Mike's Oud Forums

Syrian style Oud, completed in Dec. ´13

Fritz - 3-21-2014 at 01:55 PM

Hi guys

Don´t know if I posted some pics of the completed Oud I made in the end of last year...

A custom made lefthand Oud made for a teacher of musics in Bavaria, Germany.

Mahogany and flamed maple, rosewood fingerboard, nut bridge, scale 600mm, very fine spruce top

Have a look, please...



[file]30936[/file] [file]30938[/file] [file]30940[/file] [file]30942[/file] [file]30944[/file] [file]30946[/file]

majnuunNavid - 3-21-2014 at 10:42 PM

I really like the design of the bowl, and the back of the fingerboard. Beautiful.

Fritz - 3-23-2014 at 12:03 PM

Quote: Originally posted by majnuunNavid  
I really like the design of the bowl, and the back of the fingerboard. Beautiful.


Hi majnuunNavid

Thanks for your feedback...

Yes... the bowl has a fine shaping in wideness, lenghtness and in cross section. I made this mould after some days on working with a CAD-system on creating the pattern of the face. The mould is constructed to match even short and longer scales, and matches with the needs of a bowl with more depth oder with more flat bodies. All this can be made on this one mould.

The back of the fingerboard... I think you´re talking about the back of the neck ? This has to match with the body, I think. The pattern used to create the body with the different colours of the woods (ribs) has to be found again in the neck. That´s my opinion, may be others make it in different ways, and they do :-)

Let´s see, what´s about the next Oud I make... I´m busy with it :-) Perhaps at the end of April it´ll be completed...

Friendly greetings

Fritz

muhssin - 3-30-2014 at 07:27 PM

awesome:wavey:
PS:what is rosewood in German?

oudmood - 3-30-2014 at 08:54 PM

Rousenwoude

Fritz - 3-31-2014 at 10:00 AM

Quote: Originally posted by muhssin  
awesome:wavey:
PS:what is rosewood in German?


In german the term for rosewood is Palisander... meaning different species of a family of Dalbergia with different origins and colours and degrees of hardness.

English-speaking people say rosewood becaise of its sometimes really rosé colour.. allways tending to violet and black... but in rosewood you can find any nuance of every colour

:-)

abc123xyz - 3-31-2014 at 03:21 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Fritz  

English-speaking people say rosewood becaise of its sometimes really rosé colour.. allways tending to violet and black... but in rosewood you can find any nuance of every colour

They actually call it rosewood due to its smell.

The cut wood smells like roses, but don't smell it! It's toxic ¦·D

David

muhssin - 3-31-2014 at 07:33 PM

@Fritz
thank you

muhssin - 3-31-2014 at 07:34 PM

Quote: Originally posted by oudmood  
Rousenwoude


where did you get that from?:mad:

Fritz - 4-2-2014 at 05:55 AM

Quote: Originally posted by abc123xyz  
Quote: Originally posted by Fritz  

English-speaking people say rosewood becaise of its sometimes really rosé colour.. allways tending to violet and black... but in rosewood you can find any nuance of every colour

They actually call it rosewood due to its smell.

The cut wood smells like roses, but don't smell it! It's toxic ¦·D

David


Yeah... it smells nice... but.. roses ? :-))

Many woods are smelling very nice when cutted or working with... I like it ! The best is : Cypres... this is for me the absolute smell of wood... it reminds me immediately to flamenco-guitars...

Fritz - 4-2-2014 at 05:59 AM

Quote: Originally posted by muhssin  
Quote: Originally posted by oudmood  
Rousenwoude


where did you get that from?:mad:


This was an old fretboard for an electric guitar... about 25 years old, never used (I decided to sell all my equipment, all electric guitars and amps, but not the wood for selfmaking guitars, acoustic and electric)

I have the same in ebony, but this is in use soon... on the Oud I am just building now.

abc123xyz - 4-3-2014 at 06:12 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Fritz  
Yeah... it smells nice... but.. roses ? :-))

Yes, I've read it in more than one source, though I don't know how closely most rosewoods actually smell to roses.

The one time I made anything out of rosewood myself it did smell almost identical to dried damascus rose petals, however.

At that time I'd never given any thought to why the wood was so named, and didn't anticipate anything special in regard to its smell.

I did a lot of sawing and sanding that day and created quite a pile of dust, but strangely it was some time before I noticed the sweet fragrance, and at first I didn't even realize it was coming from the wood.

Once I noticed it, I walked around the garage taking deep breaths trying to locate the source, finally ending up back in the corner in which I'd been working, and bending over the counter sniffing the pile of sawdust.

Well I was so delighted to discover that the wood I was working with had the additional benefit of smelling so good, and I gathered up all the sawdust planning to keep it in the house like potpourri. I held that pile of dust in my hands and took several deep breaths, in bliss at the lovely smell!

You can imagine my horror when I later did some research and found out it was toxic, lol.

David

Fritz - 4-6-2014 at 12:02 AM

Quote: Originally posted by abc123xyz  
Quote: Originally posted by Fritz  
Yeah... it smells nice... but.. roses ? :-))

Yes, I've read it in more than one source, though I don't know how closely most rosewoods actually smell to roses.

The one time I made anything out of rosewood myself it did smell almost identical to dried damascus rose petals, however.

At that time I'd never given any thought to why the wood was so named, and didn't anticipate anything special in regard to its smell.

I did a lot of sawing and sanding that day and created quite a pile of dust, but strangely it was some time before I noticed the sweet fragrance, and at first I didn't even realize it was coming from the wood.

Once I noticed it, I walked around the garage taking deep breaths trying to locate the source, finally ending up back in the corner in which I'd been working, and bending over the counter sniffing the pile of sawdust.

Well I was so delighted to discover that the wood I was working with had the additional benefit of smelling so good, and I gathered up all the sawdust planning to keep it in the house like potpourri. I held that pile of dust in my hands and took several deep breaths, in bliss at the lovely smell!

You can imagine my horror when I later did some research and found out it was toxic, lol.

David



Hi David

I just read your posting... and noticed the late recognisation of the dust beeing toxic... There are different woods, smelling while working with it, and most of them are toxic... not only when breathing the dust, but alos having dust on areas of the body where the skin is thin... like the face perhaps. Even Wenge is more toxic on the skin than breathing the dust. The reaction of some cellular membranes is harmfull...

When using rosewood for a fretboard, I use to give a small amount of Lemon-Oil (special mixture for fretboards, available in most good stores dealing with equipment and parts for instruments) directly on the fretboard to cover the open cellular structures of the wood and to prevent the colour coming out... resting on the fingertips.In most cases I wipe the fretboard with pure alcohol to make sure the most colouring particles are removed. Than I can treat the face of an Oud with shellaque, very thin viscosity. You can´t see it, but you can feel it.

What are you doing today (with wood ) ? I seems you talk about the past ?

Kind regards

Fritz

abc123xyz - 4-6-2014 at 04:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Fritz  
What are you doing today (with wood ) ? I seems you talk about the past ?

Well not much lately, unfortunately, though I have worked with other woods since that first and last time with rosewood, lol.

The reason, besides the toxicity, that I gave up on rosewood was something I read in a luthiery book, which I think may have been 'Classic Guitar Making' by Arthur Overholtzer but I don't remember for sure.

It said that rosewood comes from the tree heavily permeated with pitch that should be removed to lighten the wood before building with it. The author described a tedious and time-consuming method in which the wood is soaked in some kind of solvent for a while and then drained and soaked in a fresh batch of solvent, the process being repeated a few times. He told of how thick, dark, and tar-like the solvent became after the wood had soaked in it, and there were photos showing how drastically the color of the wood was changed after this treatment.

I didn't like the thought of messing with solvents, and I didn't care for the color of the rosewood after treatment either, at least judging from the photos. It was more golden brown and chatoyant after treatment, and though lovely in its own right, was not what had attracted me to rosewood in the first place. I liked the deep reddish, almost purplish, brown color of the board I had.

David

Fritz - 4-22-2014 at 12:00 PM

Quote: Originally posted by abc123xyz  
Quote: Originally posted by Fritz  
What are you doing today (with wood ) ? I seems you talk about the past ?

Well not much lately, unfortunately, though I have worked with other woods since that first and last time with rosewood, lol.

The reason, besides the toxicity, that I gave up on rosewood was something I read in a luthiery book, which I think may have been 'Classic Guitar Making' by Arthur Overholtzer but I don't remember for sure.

It said that rosewood comes from the tree heavily permeated with pitch that should be removed to lighten the wood before building with it. The author described a tedious and time-consuming method in which the wood is soaked in some kind of solvent for a while and then drained and soaked in a fresh batch of solvent, the process being repeated a few times. He told of how thick, dark, and tar-like the solvent became after the wood had soaked in it, and there were photos showing how drastically the color of the wood was changed after this treatment.

I didn't like the thought of messing with solvents, and I didn't care for the color of the rosewood after treatment either, at least judging from the photos. It was more golden brown and chatoyant after treatment, and though lovely in its own right, was not what had attracted me to rosewood in the first place. I liked the deep reddish, almost purplish, brown color of the board I had.

David


Ah... I see !

And... Yes... it´s the natural colour of the wood making it attractive for instrument making. I agree, that soaking in solvents can´t be a good solution to treat the wood... only to make it lighter in weight and colour ??? No no...

Perhaps it might be a method to soak in alkohol for some hours to make sure not to damage the neighboured woods with the outcoming colour-pigments of rosewood for example... but never treating with acids or other destroying solvents.

Rosewood is much easyer to work with than ebony, but some Ouds want an ebony fingerboard, some require a rosewood board. It´s a thing of both weight and colour, stiffness and playability... depending on the style one is playing. And... my opinion... rosewood is more a living" wood than ebony... ebony is a sort of "steril"... meaning... often too much contrast, too hard (for the rest of the instrument)... needing sometimes a bridge made of the same wood. This results in a lower flexibilty of the area on the top where the bridge is glued on. In such a case you have to re-create the bracing... using a completely other method for the distances.