Mike's Oud Forums

Tips on making a risha

palestine48 - 11-28-2006 at 09:09 PM

Hey guys I am making a couple rishas. My teacher gave me some heavy duty zip lock stuff.

Any ideas on how to efficiently sand it down. I am using # 60 sand paper.

the plastic is about 1-1.5 mm thick. how thin should it ideally be? what should be y final dimmensions or how flexible should it be?

excentrik - 12-1-2006 at 11:06 PM

Rami- it no thang but a chicken wang- sand it down to a SHAPE you like first- make sure the tips are the at SMOOTH ANGLES angles so as not to affect your technique- try out the thickness, if it doesnt fit your needs- sand some more...

repeat-

have fun- maybe I can talk Mari into giving me another eagle feather from her stash... inshallah... I could get a couple, Ill pass one on to you-

Tarik

adamgood - 12-2-2006 at 01:16 AM

I made a really nice one out of a black cable tie. the material was great, easy to work with, i was surprised. Actually Dincer Dalkiliç gave me the cable tie.

it was a great mizrab...but i LOST it! bummer. I also lost a great one that my teacher gave to me. I'm made to lose these things.

so be sure to put some sort of homing device on your end product. something real James Bondish.

Tarik is right, first get your shape that you like (that's up to you. probably you have some other mizrabs/rishas to compare it to?)

For really getting the thing into shape fast, lots of people will recommend using a nice piece of broken glass. I used pieces of a broken window, worked great. basically use the sharp edge to work down the toothy parts to where they are gone. for shaping the ends here's what i did and i think this is normal...hold the glass over the edge of a table and "pluck" the glass with your future mizrab, like your picking. down down down, up up up, down up down up, etc...you'll start to see that the edges will round a bit and begin to look like a mizrab. soon (well it could be a while) you'll have a mangled looking mizrab, now you can go to work on it with the sandpaper. buff it down,make it look all pretty. for the round tips, i used the same technique with the sandpaper as with the glass.

so it's really simple. width/length/thinness? well that's for you to decide. make it too big, then you have somewhere to go.

have fun and enjoy. please don't cut yourself. and have a vacuum handy and band aids just in case.

Adam

hakeem.ram - 12-5-2006 at 10:53 AM

any picture of a finished product? perhaps it will help amateurs like me!

Thanks!

adamgood - 12-8-2006 at 06:45 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by hakeem.ram
any picture of a finished product? perhaps it will help amateurs like me!

Thanks!


well i went ahead and made a mizrab today. it took me under 1 1/2 hours. This came from a plasitc handle to a box that contained a cable modem (for anyone else in the Netherlands, it was a UPC cable modem box).

i made it using all of the techniques that i wrote above. See the attached photo which i admit is just a horrible horible scan, sorry about that but it will give you some idea.

on the left is the before (i already cut off 2 extra things that were attached and you'll see that i started rounding the edges wondering what the world's biggest mizrab felt like to play).

i cut the wide thingy in half, down the middle with some kitchen scissors, not getting an even cut so you'll see one side is thinner than the other. that's sort of nice though, for different sounds. and i have another half so now i can make another when i want.

then just shaped and sculpted with the glass.

then polished it up with really fine sandpaper.

it's playing pretty well actually, i like it alot. i'd venture to guess that it's the same material as some of these sort of gooey white rubbery mizrabs that a lot of us seem to have and occasionally use. so, now i got one of those for free.

i like making these things. i would love to find some tortoise to try making tanbur mizrab.

here's a link to the image:
http://www.adamgood.com/images/mizrab.jpg

adamgood - 12-8-2006 at 06:46 AM

ah now the image is embedded.

palestine48 - 12-8-2006 at 09:42 AM

adam im intrigued by your broken glass tip but im sorry i think i need a bit more clarification.

what you refer to as toothy parts im assuimg those are the ridges on the cable tie.

also i have some broken mirror thats about it, do u think i can shatter a bottle and get some pieces or does it have to be flat pieces of glass

adamgood - 12-8-2006 at 04:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by palestine48
what you refer to as toothy parts im assuimg those are the ridges on the cable tie.

also i have some broken mirror thats about it, do u think i can shatter a bottle and get some pieces or does it have to be flat pieces of glass


yes, toothy parts i mean the ridges on the cable tie. you'll want to grind them down to where it's smooth. or at least any part where it makes contact with the string should be smooth.

hmmm broken mirror, I can't see why that wouldn't do the trick. go for it, try it out. I have a piece of broken window. i would hesitate to use broken bottle pieces because well, i like my window chunk becuase it's nice and flat. it's big enough yet small enough that i can:
1) lay it on the edge of a table, hold it in place with one hand while I strike it with the mizrab in order to shape the mizrab
2) hold it (the glass) in my hand so that i can scrape it along the mizrab to fine tune it.

just experiment with little techniques and i guarantee you will find little tricks that will work for you, just use your intuition. you'll be surprised.

just keep in mind that the glass will get the thing into shape but you'll have very rough edges, the mizrab will still not be useable. get your sandpaper (very fine) on it and everything comes together really fast.

guys, where do i find plastic?? suitable for making mizrabs? like where does one get cable ties that are wide enough? (Radioshack cable ties are too skinny). Tomorrow i want to experiment with a toothbrush (hmm that sounds kinky). i think i can get something out of it.

will_oud - 12-8-2006 at 06:01 PM

Recycle those milk jugs... or I've heard that cut up credit cards will work.

William F. Sparks

palestine48 - 12-8-2006 at 08:27 PM

dude i just tried it. it works im very excited. here i am busting my humps with sand paper and the stuff peels off like an orange peel using the glass. thanks adam and tarik

palestine48 - 12-8-2006 at 08:30 PM

ijust went to the hardware store and found ties wide enough. they are in the plumbing section and are called flexible duct ties

adamgood - 12-10-2006 at 11:28 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by palestine48
dude i just tried it. it works im very excited. here i am busting my humps with sand paper and the stuff peels off like an orange peel using the glass. thanks adam and tarik


yeah, great man! i'd love to see what you are making and from what material. hey maybe we could make a trade?

There's so many materials you could use...Munir Beken showed me the mizrab that he uses, he made it out of a black hair comb! it's really thick, way thickerthan any of us are using but boy he gets a great sound. the company that makes the comb starts with a "W" i forget the name.

seriously,let me know if you wanna trade...

Adam

oudplayer - 12-10-2006 at 12:03 PM

hey guys
Nice thread
I started to make some rishis my self bc they become expensive and plus its nice when u make soemthing and you use it .
I am making alot rishis from a dvd case yeh i knwo kind of random but it works better then ever its flexable and easy to shape here are some pics befor and after. if u want info abotu it just tell me
thx sammy

oudplayer - 12-10-2006 at 12:05 PM

here

Mazin - 12-20-2006 at 01:28 PM

Thanks to all the friends, from Palastine84 to Oudplyer.

The DVD case method of Oudpyer evolved in my rusty brain to use a CD material itself. It works very well in two ways 1. I have started again plying my Oud after a week off because of the missing risha. 2. I used the only adult DVD I have (actually I hide) from my wife. So I am plying the Oud happily without the concern of been discovered!!
No need for any sand paper, just shape it by sizers and and rub it to your nearest wall. Regards

Abdul Shuker:applause:

oudplayer - 2-21-2007 at 05:50 PM

hey all

Ok after making these rishis i descoverd that they work unbaleavable. If u have a extra case you should deff do it its sounds amazing and amplified the oud dont ask me how or anyhtign about the loadness but i know tested a few rishis and this makes my oud very load.
I made alil clip for you guys me playing it hope you like it .
thx sammy
and btw my tremlo sucks i know i know
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_0p1rR-Jw7Y

Iznogoud - 2-26-2007 at 02:14 PM

I've been using natural material I've gotten through a friend in Egypt (I believe it's eagle feather?) when playing the oud, and I love the feel and tone of it.

My question is this -- I started experimenting with the concept of playing the guitar (mostly nylon-string acoustic) with an oud pick a year or so ago and have gone through a number of plastic materials, experimenting with their durability, elasticity and their tone. Eagle feather is too frail for use with a guitar. Would anyone here have good suggestions? With the guitar, dealing with chords etc the material has to be a bit more sturdy (hence, a thicker pick with the material I've used) than the kind I use for oud playing. Ideally, I'd need something that I can make a thinner pick with, but that wouldn't snap as easily.

Any ideas?

hakeem.ram - 2-26-2007 at 09:08 PM

just tried the DVD method. seems okie but the material is a bit too stiff for me though. nice thread!

Ronny Andersson - 2-27-2007 at 12:50 PM

Try out horn, I made some years ago horn risha to a American blues guitarist and he was very pleased with them (after a while he made them himself after my instructions).
It is very easy to adjust the horn and horn comes in various qualities and a much better material than all these plastic junk rishas.
Quote:
Originally posted by Iznogoud
I've been using natural material I've gotten through a friend in Egypt (I believe it's eagle feather?) when playing the oud, and I love the feel and tone of it.

My question is this -- I started experimenting with the concept of playing the guitar (mostly nylon-string acoustic) with an oud pick a year or so ago and have gone through a number of plastic materials, experimenting with their durability, elasticity and their tone. Eagle feather is too frail for use with a guitar. Would anyone here have good suggestions? With the guitar, dealing with chords etc the material has to be a bit more sturdy (hence, a thicker pick with the material I've used) than the kind I use for oud playing. Ideally, I'd need something that I can make a thinner pick with, but that wouldn't snap as easily.

Any ideas?

Microber - 2-27-2007 at 01:05 PM

I agree with you Ronny.
Since I received my free horn risha from the Nile Shop, I can't play with the plastic ones anymore.

Iznogoud - 2-27-2007 at 03:48 PM

Thanks for the tips, guys. Any idea where I could get some of the material (based in Finland)? What horn are we talking?

Ronny Andersson - 3-5-2007 at 03:32 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Iznogoud
Thanks for the tips, guys. Any idea where I could get some of the material (based in Finland)? What horn are we talking?


We are talking about larger horns from African cow breeds. The cows here in Scandinavia or elsewhere here in Europe have often very short horns and also to bend and if they are at all allowed have their horns! The horns are normally removed at early age.
I buy them at either handcraft shops or bring them myself from West Africa. These horns reach up to 1 meter and the texture of horn varies from transparent to soft little bit porous white. I prefer to use the dense parts which are very durable and adjustable for your own preferences. I believe I have some horn plectra and let me know if you want to try out.
I really don’t recommend making them yourself since the work incorporated is more than one can imagine and it is a very smelly and boring job. Just try a horn risha!

adamgood - 3-5-2007 at 11:59 AM

Ronny,

How would you go about cutting off a piece from a horn for making a risha or plectrum?

thanks for the cool info. I'd love to look for horn here in Holland but i actually think it's illegal to buy, does that make sense?

best,
Adam

Ronny Andersson - 3-7-2007 at 12:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by adamgood
Ronny,

How would you go about cutting off a piece from a horn for making a risha or plectrum?

thanks for the cool info. I'd love to look for horn here in Holland but i actually think it's illegal to buy, does that make sense?

best,
Adam



Adam, I have made photos of the process some years ago and I just need to locate the photos and scan them and then I post them here I describe it. I believe the trade with European horns is illegal due to the mad cow disease (BSE). I remember Bill Killpatrick lamenting some years ago about his problem to find larger horns in Italy so I had to send him a horn from an African cow but I believe the horn ended up as a flower pot for some exotic grass.

zalzal - 3-7-2007 at 01:08 PM

I got 3 years ago fm a friend travelling Casablanca some horn's rishas. It was
not easy to find quickly horn risha's in Casablanca for someone not related with oud but finally there was a shop doing it. This could mean that horn's rishas are being less used than before in Morocco. Anyhow it seems they are made with bulls. I'm not sure, may be is goat. They have almost all an oval form, like a boomerang...
In my hands they bend quickly after some days of use, and i sanded them often, as they were quickly eroded, sometimes even i reshaped with scissors.
Well, this is may be a criminal transgression...
I have now a galli's pure "chemical plastic pvc" risha since 2 years, right, hard and stiff, allways the same, just sanded it twice.
I also heard fm some oudist shaping rishas fm plastic bottles of water.
Anyhow horn's rishas may me still dream of a more natural animal sound.
I may come again to horn rishas, as Microber

Brynley - 3-7-2007 at 07:19 PM

I,ve just lost my favorite risha, it was given to me by a luthier friend who plays Lauota, made out of a strip of whats known as "clown puke" that ugly multicolored plastic matierial sometimes used for pickguards. He just cut it into strips and used it like that ,I sanded mine into shape. I,m missing it...........now I,ve just got to find some inebriated clown and................................

Red - 3-16-2007 at 04:37 PM

Great! The new cleaning lady threw away my best risha, I leave it laying on my desk at home. Then i thought "thank god i have my other Risha", then i realized that the second risha was also laying on my desk...

So now i need to make or purchase some. I loved that risha, it has a rubbery feel to it, anyone know where i can get some or what the material is?

Brynley - 3-17-2007 at 04:37 PM

I know what it s like to lose a favorite risha, they just seem to vanish sometimes. I,ve noticed Jameel at khalafoud@khalafoud.com has blanks for sale of a couple of different matierials to shape yourself, even sanding boards to save the trauma of going to the manicurist..........I don,t know about the rubbery feel , but it,s worth it to try different matierials to find what you like, good luck!