Mike's Oud Forums

D'Addarrio J95 strings - too high tension for arabic ouds?

Aymara - 11-8-2009 at 05:57 AM

Hi everybody,

my new oud is stringed with the D'Addario J95 string set originally designed for turkish ouds.

I have an arabic oud (59cm string length), which is tuned to C-F-A-d-g-c and I would rate the tension of the strings when playing as medium.

Now I read HERE in Pablo's oud website, that the tension of these strings is too high for an arabic oud.

On the website of Khalaf Oud Luthiery we can find THIS string tension table.

So the following tensions should be expected ... correct?

c (.022 diameter) = 2.37 kg
g (.028 diameter) = ???
d (.025w diameter) = ???
A (.029w diameter) = 3.58 kg
F (.033w diameter) = 3.46 kg
C (.041w diameter) = 3.07 kg

Should I be concerned? I mean, they are tuned lower that they are ment to be, so is Pablo really correct?

PS: Does anybody know the maximum string tensions for arabic ouds?

Hatem_Afandi - 11-8-2009 at 06:35 AM

Chris,

Please remove the D'Addariom strings NOW. They might damage the sound board.
I made that mistake a few years ago and the result was a disaster!!!!

I use Lablella
You can order them from:

http://www.khalafoud.com/strings.htm

Good luck

Aymara - 11-8-2009 at 07:17 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Hatem_Afandi  

I made that mistake a few years ago and the result was a disaster!!!!


Thanks for the warning :bowdown:

fernandraynaud - 11-8-2009 at 09:57 AM

Relax. Your oud is OK. If you've taken your dangerous strings off, send them to me, I will save your oud by putting them on one of mine. If they are still on, leave them on. There is no difference between Arabic and Turkish. The shorter scale is tuned 2 half steps higher, it's about equal.

Those gauges are perfectly safe for an oud with a scale around 60 cm tuned Arabic CFFAADDggcc, or a shorter scale oud tuned Turkish (2 half-tones up). They are NOT safe for tuning up to ff.

Hatem_Afandi must have had some other problems. There's nothing about the well-known D'Addario J95 set that's extreme or unsafe. Many people use them, on both Turkish and Arabic. These are the gauges that most new professional ouds come with. On the package you may find they label the tuning as per Turkish NOTATION, and THAT confuses everybody. For instance, Music Outfitters shows

( OUDG ) La Bella Oud String Set, Turkish
By J. D'Addario. 11 Strings in 6 envelopes. G strings, 1st & 2nd plain nylon .022; D strings 3rd & 4th plain nylon .028; A strings, 5th & 6th silver-plated wound .025; E strings, 7th & 8th silver-plated wound .029; B strings, 9th & 10th silver-plated wound .033; F# string 11th silver-plated wound .041. Made in USA. (Out of Stock)

Huh? And by D'Addario, too? Good thing they are out of stock. :D

The Daniel Mari is considered a low tension set, and the gauges are about the same as the D'Addario. D'Addario only makes that one set.

The LaBella OU80A "Arabic" set has some strange tuning listed if you can ever find it. The bass string is a 0.033". I can tell you that if you tune a 0.033" to C on a 59 cm scale oud, you will feel like you are playing a dead fish. You remember that the C on my ouds was not very loud? That was with a 0.042" string. You really think you want a 0.033"?


katakofka - 11-8-2009 at 10:43 AM

I use the J95 on a 60cm stringlength oud I have It works perfectly. So I guess on a 59cm it should work as well. Hatem probably used this set on a 61 or 62cm oud. Indeed, is this case the J95 would be high in tension and might damage the oud.
I use the wound strings only from the J95, the nylon strings I replace them by PVF strings from another company. However, you can use the 0.028 as a cc string but not the 0.022 since the later would be too loose on a 59cm oud.
I would use the whole set but you will be in need for a gg strings that you can order separately. On a 59cm the 0.034 should work well as a gg strings
http://www.khalafoud.com/daddario.htm

Aymara - 11-8-2009 at 10:55 AM

Quote: Originally posted by fernandraynaud  
If you've taken your dangerous strings off, ...


I just loosened the strings to be on the save side, until further information is available. Thank god, that tuning works like a charme on this oud ;)
Quote:
There is no difference between Arabic and Turkish.


Yes, I know, they only have this turkish set, which can be used for arabic ouds too by tuning the strings accordingly ... that's the description on Khalaf's website.
Quote:
Those gauges are perfectly safe for an oud with a scale around 60 cm tuned Arabic CFFAADDggcc ...


My scale is 59 cm as mentioned above and I used the CFFAADDggcc tuning.

If we compare with Pyramid orange set ...

c (.027 diameter) = 3.9 kg
g (.031 diameter) = 2.8 kg
d (.023w diameter) = 4.0 kg
A (.028w diameter) = 3.8 kg
G (.032w diameter) = 4.0 kg
C (.041w diameter) = ???

... it seems, you're right.
Quote:
On the package you may find they label the tuning as per Turkish NOTATION, ...


Yes, as F#-B-E-a-d-g', which is C#-F#-B-e-a-d' in western notation.
Quote:
And by D'Addario, too?


Can't believe it :rolleyes: Does that mean, D'Addario and LaBella strings are identical? The gauges you posted are.
Quote:
BTW What did you end up getting?


Sabbassi's rosewood oud sounded to nice to say no ;)

Aymara - 11-8-2009 at 11:03 AM

Quote: Originally posted by katakofka  
However, you can use the 0.028 as a cc string but not the 0.022 since the later would be too loose on a 59cm oud.


Both, the gg string (0.028) and the cc string (0.022) were ok, not too loose in my opinion. But their sound isn't optimal for my taste. The wounded strings sound much better.

I'm thinking about a string change with Kürschner strings ... I had a chance for a short test on a Faruk Türünz arabic oud last week ... great ... low tension, top sound.

sabbassi - 11-8-2009 at 12:44 PM

thanks chris enjoy it.
Like I said to you, different people have different experiences and history
D'ddario string are fine don't wory. the ud is well constructed ;)

Aymara - 11-8-2009 at 01:07 PM

Quote: Originally posted by sabbassi  
..., different people have different experiences and history ...


Shure. But it's an interesting topic, isn't it. I think katakofka found the reason for Hatem's disaster ... a longer scale, maybe 62 cm? I hope Hatem reports, if that's correct.
Quote:
the ud is well constructed


... and very inspiring ... I'm astonished about my progress in learning oud ... much faster as I expected :airguitar:

BTW ... I'll send you a U2U soon about the german wood ... the investigation is more complex as expected.