ALAMI
Oud Junkie
Posts: 645
Registered: 12-14-2006
Location: Beirut
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Abdo Nahat - Damascus 1929
I don't really "go hunting" for old ouds, I talk around, leave my phone number to people and then it happens that an oud path crosses mine. For some
reason it is the 3rd time that I went for one oud and came with two.
So I went to see this guy who wanted to show me the Awadikian, it was far and I was very late and while at his place a guy came visiting. Just when I
was leaving with the Awadikian, this other guy asked me if I'd be interested to see an old oud he inherited from his aunt who was a singer. He
explained to me that the the oud is made by a "guy" called Nahat who was very famous.
Sometimes you just get lucky.
It is a Abdo made in 1929 in perfect condition, this oud was never touched or repaired. Except for some knife-butchered pegs and a wooden nut that
may not be original, everything is perfect. This is a simple oud without any kind of decoration, the face is as horizontal as glass, only some dust
and some small stains.
The action is so low and no buzz. It is probably a woman model, it is incredibly light:
830 grs with the pegs. How this guy was able to make the wood so thin and the oud so light and it has no deformation after 82 years! the oud was kept
unprotected, not even in fabric bag.
The small rosettes have a butterfly, I've never seen a butterfly on a Nahat before.
The label is in Arabic and French, it indicates it was made in 20th of April 1929, serial number 2500. Abdo's photo on the upper right side has his
name above the photo and the date 1900 or 1908 under the photo.
It is a 5 course
Stringlength 62 cm
Fingerboard 20.5 cm
Bowl 49 X 35 X 19.5 cm
Holes 12 & 3.5 cm
|
|
|
Luttgutt
Oud Junkie
Posts: 578
Registered: 1-10-2009
Location: Norway
Member Is Offline
Mood: Curious
|
|
Alf mabrouk ALAMI!!
This one is almost identical to mine (I have two from around the same period).
Yes, as mine, this is a "woman cut" (assa nisweniyye) as they called it at the time!
Lovely oud, isn't it 
p.s. When I visit Lebanon, I'll check if I have a butterfly on mine! And maybe we can meet this summer?
The wood might be dead, but the oud is alive.
|
|
|
mavrothis
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1674
Registered: 6-5-2003
Location: NJ/NYC
Member Is Offline
Mood: big band envy
|
|
Both of your finds are really beautiful. It really is amazing like you said that the Nahat, as delicate as it is, has withstood all these years
unprotected.
Alf mabrouk!
mavrothis
|
|
|
alfaraby
Oud Junkie
Posts: 796
Registered: 9-18-2009
Location: Holy Land
Member Is Offline
Mood: Cool
|
|
The oud is a real beauty but is still a mystery !
The label says George Abdo Nahat , so is the photo, while the rose says Abdo Nahat & his son Elias !!
Dr. Oud explained here : http://www.droud.com/NahatGenealogy2.htm
who's who of the Nahat tribe: Abdo George Nahat is the cousin of Abdo Elias Nahat (& his son Elias) , so it's a mess , isn't it ?
Tell us more about it
yours
Alfaraby
|
|
|
Ararat66
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1025
Registered: 11-14-2005
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: mellow yellow
|
|
Hi Alami
Those two ouds are really something - 830 grams is so light -lighter than my Tasos. We had a meeting in Oxford UK last weekend when Nizar Rohana came
over and Kelly and Dave H have just got a Nahat each, Kelly's with the original sound board and they are amazing to play, and as you say so light and
thin - and very responsive and 'easy' to play.
That other oud of yours looks supercharged  ) actually my Tasos moves down from
just above the neck but this is not string tension it is a built in wave that the sound board follows so it is flat laterally across the sound board
right to the bowl edges, but down the medial line from ogee to tail there is a gentle wave - I wonder if that is what is built into the Awadikian
soundboard.
How's your playing going by the way, with all those fabulous ouds you must be slowly turning into one
I still have that piece you did years ago 'lonely djinn', I really like that - why don't you post it again but on one of these ouds and with your present way of playing??
Best wishes
Leon
|
|
|
Danielo
Oud Junkie
Posts: 365
Registered: 7-17-2008
Location: Paris
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Great find Alami and nice story ! Congratulations my friend Play it with lot of
happiness
Those undecorated Nahats are really my favorite ones...
Your other find is also nice !
regards,
Dan
PS: Alfaraby, it actually corroborates my opinion: I think that Elias was the son of Abdo George. Here is our previous thread on this subject
http://www.mikeouds.com/messageboard/viewthread.php?tid=9897#pid698...
|
|
|
alfaraby
Oud Junkie
Posts: 796
Registered: 9-18-2009
Location: Holy Land
Member Is Offline
Mood: Cool
|
|
I've been there !!
I think Elias is the son of Abdo Elias & not Abdo George
I'm still confused about this oud, the rosette is the problem
I don't know, just wondering
Yours
Alfaraby
|
|
|
ALAMI
Oud Junkie
Posts: 645
Registered: 12-14-2006
Location: Beirut
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Thanks a lot my friends for your kind words.
Al Faraby raised a very good point and I was researching this since yesterday.
I think that there is no Elias Abdo Elias and may be not even a Abdo Elias , at least as oudmakers. I am afraid that Richard's genealogy is not
accurate here.
ELIAS is the son of ABDO GEORGE ("the" Abdo)
1- the first attached pic is the label of the Abdo Nahat oud who belonged to the famous singer Marie Gibran, made in 1921.
The label has printed on it: Abdu George Nahat in Latin letters and underneath added in hand writing : & his son Elias. No Arab (actually no one)
would ever lie or cheat when it comes to father's name. This oud has only the name of abdo on his rosette (Pic 2)
2- Later on the printed name on the label changed to Abdu Nahat & sons, the 2 sons being George the elder son and Elias the younger son. From this
period we see on the rosettes "Abdu Nahat & Sons" pics 3 and 4
3- Later on George left to work on his own and Elias stayed with his father Abdo, we started seeing "Abdu & his son Elias
on the rosettes but the label stayed "Abdu Nahat & sons"
Look at these exact same 2 very famous Abdu rosettes once bearing Abdu &sons and once Abdu & his son Elias.
pics 5 & 6
4- the serial numbers stayed consistent and consecutive over the years whether the rosettes were signed Abdu Only, Abdu & sons then Abdu &
Elias. #2161 in 1924 - #2333 in 1927 - #2500 in 1929
I think that there was no other Abdu who made ouds and It is obvious for me that Elias was the son on Abdo George.
The same Abdu signed during his carreer:
Nahat Ikhwan, Abdu Nahat, Abdu&sons, Abdu & his son Elias.
I really would like to hear what others thinks and specially Richard
|
|
|
ALAMI
Oud Junkie
Posts: 645
Registered: 12-14-2006
Location: Beirut
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Hey Leon, it is amazing that you still remember this piece, in fact a few days ago I was thinking of re-recording it, complete this time, I think that
my playing should have somehow improved in 4 years. thank you for the encouragement. I'd only be able to play it on a 7 course, well it'd be the
golden mean one who's maturing nicely.
|
|
|
alfaraby
Oud Junkie
Posts: 796
Registered: 9-18-2009
Location: Holy Land
Member Is Offline
Mood: Cool
|
|
Quote: Originally posted by ALAMI  | ELIAS is the son of ABDO GEORGE ("the" Abdo)
4- the serial numbers stayed consistent and consecutive over the years whether the rosettes were signed Abdu Only, Abdu & sons then Abdu &
Elias. #2161 in 1924 - #2333 in 1927 - #2395 in 1928 - #2500 in 1929
|
This makes real sense. Now it's clear more than ever that there were no other Abdos but Abdo George Nahat the GREAT !
But why did George Abdo left his father & brother ? Did he make his own ouds ? If yes, where are they ?
The serial numbers are right . Here is mine from 1928 & it matches the rest : # 2395 in 1928 !
Thanks ALAMI for this innovative explanation
Yours
Alfaraby
|
|
|
Adel Salameh
Oud Junkie
Posts: 235
Registered: 4-18-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
goog find Alami, some of these simple Abdo nahat ouds are the best produced by the nahat family.
I find it very hard to beleive that the roses are original....I have seen another oud made by Abdo nahat and his son with this kind of Shamsiya , this
oud came out of lebanon too.....not very clean......something that we never see in an original nahat Abdo nahat oud.....Elias stayed with his father
and produced many ouds with the name of abdo nahat and his son or abdo nahat his son Elias.....
these roses have been changed at some point.....the ouds which produced by his son too are very very claen....you only have to look at the work of
abdo nahat son oud at the museum in Paris to give you an idea.
never the less enjoy the oud and play it in good health.
Adel
http://www.myspace.com/adelsalameh
|
|
|
Ararat66
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1025
Registered: 11-14-2005
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: mellow yellow
|
|
Hi Alami
I look forward to hearing that - I liked the original because it was very heartfelt and the relatively young technique as you imply seemed to bring
this out more. There's more to playing than technique thank god ) but it sure
helps.
Cheers
Leon
|
|
|
ALAMI
Oud Junkie
Posts: 645
Registered: 12-14-2006
Location: Beirut
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Thank you Adel for your wishes and for sharing your thoughts and experience.
Well if you compare those simple rosettes to the sophisticated great ones, you're right, they don't look of same quality.
We all know that there is a fake Nahat market. Even a genuine Nahat without roses would sell for less than the one with roses so people may be tempted
to "add" rosettes, that's why I don't buy old ouds from "Professionals" (I did it once years ago and I kinda regret it). The guy I bought the oud
from is a simple humble man who knows nothing about ouds and doesn't even play. The oud was sitting on the top of an old closet with years of dust.
For me it is clear that there is no "Modern" rosettes forgery. An old forgery or repair ? may be.
But again, if we look today to the models proposed by a great luthier like Mr Turunz, we'll see a big difference between the simple model and the
fully ornated one, in look an price. In the future, when they'll put in a museum one of Faruk ouds (may god give him a long and healthy life),
probably it is going to be the fully ornated one.
The Nahats used to make ouds from very simple to incredibly rich and ornated "Pasha ouds", we also tend to forget that they were "atelier de
menuiserie" making also furniture and that was always written on the label, meaning they had employees and we can imagine that the master won't work
by himself on every single detail of the "lower market" ouds.
It is known that when Mohamad Fadel was old, he used to do only the barring of the face himself, the rest of the oud was carried by employees.
By looking back to the attached pics, it looks like the simple ouds have wood rosettes with central white tinted wood signature, the ornated ouds have
full white bone or ivory rosettes, it looks like a standard for the 20s-30s production. It is clear that the full white rosettes are in a higher
quality league.
By the way, I found one with butterfly small rosettes (pic 2)
I don't know, I am just doing an analysis and not in anyway stating historical facts.
Thanks Al Faraby for agreeing with the first analysis, coming from someone with your experience, it makes it a highly probable theory.
And Geko, let's have a Lebanon oud meeting this summer, who's interested ?
|
|
|
Adel Salameh
Oud Junkie
Posts: 235
Registered: 4-18-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Thanks Alami,
I sttll beleive that the roses are not original....who cares ? if you like the sound of the oud , it's the most important thing...it looks great this
oud ...
even if the oud is a very simple one , you still have a very clean shamsiya....I have seen many of these ouds ...in the photos which you posted you
can see the roses are very clean except the second one which is not very clean because it's not original too.
these makers were very clean apart from George nahat.
best wishes,
Adel
|
|
|
ALAMI
Oud Junkie
Posts: 645
Registered: 12-14-2006
Location: Beirut
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Yeah, I guess Adel is right, who cares ?
I've worked the pegs and stringed the oud, played it and loving it.
After all that's what we really care about.
I don't know for how long this oud has not being played, with an 1 hour-old strings, that's how it sounds, raw file:
Attachment: Abdo_Nahawand.mp3 (810kB)
This file has been downloaded 518 times
|
|
|
Ararat66
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1025
Registered: 11-14-2005
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: mellow yellow
|
|
Leon
|
|
|
Manil
Oud Maniac
Posts: 77
Registered: 3-19-2010
Member Is Offline
|
|
Beautiful sound and playing, too bad strings are not perfect yet, hope we'll have another sound clip in one week
I am really impressed with the warm sound this Oud. Feel like I am in the fifties
|
|
|
Kelly
Oud Junkie
Posts: 285
Registered: 1-30-2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Hi Alami
Great sounding oud- play in good health.
what kind of new strings have you fitted?
Do these older ouds tolerate tighter strings at concert pitch or is it best to tune lower?
btw Leon my new old oud is not, unfortunately, a Nahat tho a good example of a 1940's Syrian oud- possibly Mohammed Safi --the bowl and soundboard
are original neck/pegs are not. nice simple design but great ringing tone.
Kelly
|
|
|
Ararat66
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1025
Registered: 11-14-2005
Location: Portsmouth, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: mellow yellow
|
|
Hi Kelly
I didn't realise - but regardless of that it's fantastic to play, when we were together last weekend I played it for about 40 or 50 minutes outside at
Dave's in the quadrangle and the sound really carried - I probably got a bit carried away myself) not that that ever happens to me normally !!
Its a lovely oud and there is something in its dry thin top that has the sound of experience even in a novice like me. What strings did you have on
it btw.
Leon
|
|
|
Kelly
Oud Junkie
Posts: 285
Registered: 1-30-2007
Location: Manchester, UK
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Hi Leon
Just put on some Mari strings 2 weeks ago though going to change to Kurschner mediums coz she's worth it!
Kelly
|
|
|
alfaraby
Oud Junkie
Posts: 796
Registered: 9-18-2009
Location: Holy Land
Member Is Offline
Mood: Cool
|
|
Adel : George Abdo or George Hanna ?
Did George Abdo make his own ouds, after he had left his father & started his own business ?
ALAMI : Thanks for the compliment, I really appreciate that very much coming from an expert like yourself ! You deserve such a
pearl, especially when found as described ! Alf Mabrouk !
I'd love to come over to Lebanon, but what to do with the wired fence & land mines planted along the border ? Consider Cyprus & I'm being
serious .
Yours
Alfaraby
|
|
|
Adel Salameh
Oud Junkie
Posts: 235
Registered: 4-18-2008
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
George hanna nahat....
george abdo ....I have never heard of him nor seen any of his ouds ...was he a maker? if yes where are his ouds? can we see a label?
best wishes,
Adel
|
|
|
ALAMI
Oud Junkie
Posts: 645
Registered: 12-14-2006
Location: Beirut
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Kelly, I put Pyramid Lute, I am using the set p25 from Matthias.
I usually tune lower, but take them up sometimes, never had a problem. Lutgutt confirmed that it's a women model, I guess it used to be tuned high.
Al Faraby, you're most welcome, you can also use Amman for transit. Looks like those landmines are going to stay there for a while, just hoping that
they won't extend.
According to Dr oud, George Abdo made a oud for Farid, attached Farid and his Nahat ? Is it the George Abdo , the only one?
May be George Abdo got rich and stopped making ouds.
|
|
|
Danielo
Oud Junkie
Posts: 365
Registered: 7-17-2008
Location: Paris
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Hi Alami,
thanks for the mp3 I really like your playing and the sound you get from this oud
About George Abdo's ouds, were brazilian Nahats made my him?
Dan
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xmbprobrown/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
