em.20
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 8-27-2011
Location: Germany
Member Is Offline
|
|
Recommandation for a saw?
Hello,
I want to buy an electric saw for building ouds. Mainly the saw will be used to cut the ribs but of course also for other steps. I have a few
questions.
1. I don't know whether a band saw or a table circular saw is the right one? I guess a band saw is more flexible, but the circular saw is more precise
in straight cuts!?
2. I've picked some cheap examples of saws, but maybe you can say me wether these will be enough for building ouds or not?
3. Do I need a sabre saw additionaly to cut for example the form of the ribs, the soundboard or the blocks?
4. Do you recommend a belt grinder for smoothing and the precision work?
http://www.woodster.de/en/products/products/categories/tischkreissa...
http://www.amazon.de/Universal-BANDSAEGE-BS-205-302410/dp/B002SA7QI...
|
|
|
SamirCanada
Moderator
Posts: 3405
Registered: 6-4-2004
Member Is Offline
|
|
Hi there,
The one thing you really need a saw for is to make the ribs. Almost everything can be made with hand tools. It just takes a little more time and
precision.
In my experience the most versatile power saw in the workshop for ouds is the bandsaw. Also, it is one of the safest powertools since its very
predictable.
It can be used to make the following peices which will speed up the process and make things more acurate:
- rough out neck block and tail block.
- pegbox curved shapes
- the neck
- the ribs (need the right blade and time to adjust the saw to cut 100% straight)
- very usefull to build molds.
A table saw cannot do curves but it is very precise. In my opinion with a fine blade it is better than the bandsaw to cut the ribs as it makes
straighter cuts that require less planning afterwards.
You dont need a saw to cut out the soundboards. a sharp wood knife is used for that typically.
I dont know about those saws in your post so I cant advise. I heard that BOSH makes good table saws.
Dont buy a belt sander right away. you can use sandpaper glued to a flat substrate. Much better.
@samiroud Instagram
samiroudmaker@gmail.com
|
|
|
em.20
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 8-27-2011
Location: Germany
Member Is Offline
|
|
I am in the same opinion like you, Samir. The bandsaw is more versatile and flexible but the table saw is better in making straight cuts.
I would definately buy a bandsaw but I've read that the bandsaw is not recommended for straight cuts and for cutting the ribs, I think this is a very
important point.
I am unsure!
|
|
|
SamirCanada
Moderator
Posts: 3405
Registered: 6-4-2004
Member Is Offline
|
|
You can always find someone to cut the ribs for you in advance. actually this is better for the wood to adjust to the relative humidity in the room.
@samiroud Instagram
samiroudmaker@gmail.com
|
|
|
em.20
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 8-27-2011
Location: Germany
Member Is Offline
|
|
I've tried to cut some ribs of a 3cm high piece of spruce with the table saw of a friend. That one is a cheap exemplar like the ones I've written in
the opening post. The saw couldn't cut after 10cm and was nearly to explode. )
So I must find another solution. Finding someone to cut the ribs is of course a good idea but it makes me less flexible in a lot of other processes.
Sabbassi is using a Bosch table saw which I've seen on some pictures. If it is the Bosch PTS 10, I could consider to buy it which costs nearly 340€
here. For band saws it was recommended me to buy an old one from the 80s with the brand "Metabo" or "Elektra Beckum". Cheap bandsaws should be nothing
more than a toy.
|
|
|
jdowning
Oud Junkie
Posts: 3485
Registered: 8-2-2006
Location: Ontario, Canada
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
I have been using an American made Rockwell Model 14 bandsaw for all of my 'resaw' work (for both instrument and non instrument projects) for the past
30 years. It has its faults but is substantially built of cast iron with a machined flat cast iron table. As it is currently set up it can cut up to 6
inches (15 cm) in depth using a 3/8 or 1/2 inch wide blade with 3 teeth per inch - powered by a 3/4 Horse Power motor.
This model of bandsaw can also be set up to cut a 12 inch (30 cm) depth of cut if required.
Even at full depth it will cut perfectly straight veneers of 1 mm thickness as will any good bandsaw if properly adjusted with a good quality sharp
blade at correct tension using accurately set blade guides etc. I use the Swedish 'Viking' brand blades available from Lee Valley Ottawa. These blades
cut smoothly and efficiently with no tendency to 'wander' or 'cup'.
Bandsaws are much more versatile than table saws, generally safer to operate, less noisy and with thin blades can cut with less waste. Bandsaws cut
slower than a table saw equipped with a carbide tipped blade so should not be forced through the work as this will result in inaccurate cuts and
excessive blade wear - but what's the rush!
As with all power tools you get what you pay for. A cheap, low power table bandsaw fitted with a fine tooth blade will likely not be much use for
cutting rib blanks in hardwood even at 3 cm depth of cut.
|
|
|
em.20
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 8-27-2011
Location: Germany
Member Is Offline
|
|
I've decided to go to a carpenter to cut the ribs. The rest can also be done completely with hand tools, right? I'm thinking of cutting the
fingerboard, the neck or the pegbox.
|
|
|
jdowning
Oud Junkie
Posts: 3485
Registered: 8-2-2006
Location: Ontario, Canada
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
|
|
Yes an oud can be made entirely by using hand tools. Indeed - unless you are producing instruments in some quantity where production economies can
justify the employment of costly power tools and jigs - use of hand tools and working with care and precision is the way to go - satisfying too.
After all, ouds were being made entirely by hand centuries before the invention of electric power tools. Then, and up until the late 19th C, oud ribs
(and wood veneers) were all cut with a hand saw from a log or smaller billets of wood - a skilled trade.
Thank goodness for powered band saws!!
|
|
|
em.20
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 8-27-2011
Location: Germany
Member Is Offline
|
|
OK! That's fine.
I've another question. For what is a plane really needed? As I've seen so far it is only used for the soundboard. Is that right?
Is sanding and planing not the same?
|
|
|
Dr. Oud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1370
Registered: 12-18-2002
Location: Sacramento, CA, USA
Member Is Offline
Mood: better than before
|
|
Definitely get a good bandsaw, spend as much as you can afford. Straight cuts can be done by using a guide similar to a table saw. The table saw will
cut a wider kerf, wasting more wood. A plane can be used to smooth many surfaces, like the ribs after sawing. The blade must be kept sharp and the
better quality planes will keep their edge longer. Hold the plane at a slight angle to the direction you push, not perpendicular to the blade. This is
called known as a slice cut. Watch Roy Underhill's The Woodrights Shop for many valuable woodworking techniques
<http://www.pbs.org/woodwrightsshop/>. He even has plans for a peg shaper
...<http://www.pbs.org/woodwrightsshop/howto/images/e2104Rounderplane.pdf>.
|
|
|
![[*]](images/xmbprobrown/default_icon.gif){kind=icon}
