coolsciguy
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Lavta string tension question
Hi folks,
I recently acquired a fairly nice Lavta that has a 66 cm scale and a proper setup/string action. I am using Turkish oud strings on this Lavta and the
tuning I am using is DAdg.
I find the string tension to be too high, so much that I need to take a break after playing it for 5-10 minutes. String tension is also affecting
sonority and playability, such that some oud techniques are much more difficult to execute (e.g. arabic turn).
I was wondering if my experience as a new Lavta player is common and I just need to bear with it. Alternatively, I can order custom string sets with
less tension and take it from there. Has anyone gone down this route?
Many thanks!
-- Amir
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Jody Stecher
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Are you using Turkish oud strings designed for the pitches to which you are tuning them? That would produce a very high tension as Turkish ouds
usually have a much shorter scale than 66cm. I had a lavta in my hands only once. The strings were tighter than on oud but not painful to play.
Perhaps Lavta players use lighter gauges than would go on any oud. (?)
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coolsciguy
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Quote: Originally posted by Jody Stecher  | Are you using Turkish oud strings designed for the pitches to which you are tuning them? That would produce a very high tension as Turkish ouds
usually have a much shorter scale than 66cm. I had a lavta in my hands only once. The strings were tighter than on oud but not painful to play.
Perhaps Lavta players use lighter gauges than would go on any oud. (?)
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Hi Jody,
Thanks for your insight. The designated pitches for turkish strings would be EBea and I am having my Lavta tuned DAdg which is a whole step lower.
In terms of playability, the most discomfort comes from holding down the strings against the soft frets, so it's mostly finger fatigue than pain. You
can think of a newb guitar player who might have similar fatigue holding strings down against frets or holding chords with left hand. This fatigue is
likely because of the frets to an extent that are non existent on the oud.
-- Amir
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Jody Stecher
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I'm not sure if I understand. Are you placing your fingers on top of the frets?
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coolsciguy
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Jody, I play a few other fretted instruments and don't have issues with holding frets effectively/correctly. In the case of my Lavta, I think the high
string tension makes it difficult to hold frets effectively and causes tension buildup in my left hand fingers.
-- Amir
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Brian Prunka
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Tuning down a step is within a reasonable margin of error to compensate for the move from 585mm to 660mm scale length in order to get a similar
tension.
So assuming your description of the situation is accurate, the tension is not high.
It doesn't take any more effort to push strings down to meet the frets than it does to push them down to meet the fingerboard, so this is a perplexing
hypothesis.
I apologize in advance, but the only thing I can think of is that you are mistaken about something (strings, scale length, setup), or your technique
is in some way causing the problem (hand position, excessive pressure on the strings).
Since all we can do is guess at the problem, for a fretted instrument the following are things I'd suggest exploring:
1) fingers go as close to the fret as possible without literally being on top of them, this will reduce the pressure needed to achieve a clean
sound.
2) fingers press down only as far as needed to reach the fret firmly, and are not supposed to push all the way to the fingerboard as you would without
frets - in fact this will make the strings play out of tune. This is a common problem when switching between instruments that require differing
amounts of pressure.
3) the hand is leveraging the pressure between the fingers and thumb, not squeezing, the wrist is relaxed and the palm of the hand and ball of the
thumb are uninvolved. Squeezing is inefficient and causes fatigue/pain.
If the nut is too high, this can make it difficult to play in the first position or two, but since you said it's set up properly that seem unlikely to
be the issue.
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Brian Prunka
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You could also try tuning down even more and see what the results are like, this will give something of an approximation of trying a set with lower
tension.
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coolsciguy
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Hey Brian, this is exactly the type of analysis I was hoping to get from my post, so thank you for your elaborate answer!
| Quote: | | So assuming your description of the situation is accurate, the tension is not high. You could also try tuning down even more and see what the results
are like, this will give something of an approximation of trying a set with lower tension. |
Great insight, I actually tried tuning my Lavta down a step to get a sense for lower tension but the instrument didn't respond well and the sound
suffered. Having said that, some techniques (like the arabic turn) are harder to implement on the Lavta that I attributed to string tension but it's
perhaps due to other factors.
| Quote: |
I apologize in advance, but the only thing I can think of is that you are mistaken about something (strings, scale length, setup), or your technique
is in some way causing the problem (hand position, excessive pressure on the strings). |
You are actually very on point and no need to apologize! I am new to Lavta and trying to find my way forward. I did try all the great points you made
and that helped a lot. I now realize that the left hand positioning and technique on the Lavta is quite distinctive from the oud and I need to work on
my left hand to establish technique. After analyzing my left hand, I realized most tension build up is with my thumb due to it's positioning of the
thumb behind fret board. This will be my next issue to resolve and now I have the tools to do it because of your insight.
Thank you again Brian for your invaluable insight!
-- Amir
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