billkilpatrick
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andalusia
could i please ask one of the arab speakers to give me a literal translation of the word andalusia. i know its geographical location - i'd just like
to know if the word has a literal meaning in arabic.
thank you - bill
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palestine48
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My understanding of arabic is mainly simplistic but coincidently i was looking up terns in the wikipeda.com sight offers some history to the word.
there are a few theories
1. the name was an arabic pronunciation of the term vandalucia which was given to the area buy the germanic tribe called the vandals
2. the name was an arabic translation of a word given by the visgoths
3. the area was named by the arabs properly as "jazirat el andalus" which translates to "atlantis" or island of the atlantic.
Aside from that, in regards to emads comment yes it is true that when you try to give a human recognition to a subject, generally in arabic and also
in english, you refer to that subject in a female tense.
So if third theory holds then adalusia was probably a nickname of the proper name of the area but given in the female sense.
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billkilpatrick
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i offer an alternative meaning: andare is italian for "to go" - luce is "light." bearing in mind the gradual degradation of latin all over the
mediterranian region and spain's westerly position in relation to rome, could it be that andalusia simply means "place where light goes" or "sun set?"
conversely ... alba means "dawn" and it stands to reason, therefore that albania means "place where sun rises."
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palestine48
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its possible, the wikipedia site said the visgoths theory was that the visgoths used a roman name for another province. So there are several theories
out there. I will ask my dad if he knows a translation, he is pretty educated in the arabic language.
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DJCrabtree
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The historian Bettany Hughes presented a documentary on UK Channel 4 this weekend, called "When the Moors Ruled Spain". She stated categorically that
the name Al-Andalus was simply Arabic for '(Land) of the Vandals', Vandal being another name for Visigoth.
All the best,
David
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Faladel
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| Quote: | Originally posted by DJCrabtree
The historian Bettany Hughes presented a documentary on UK Channel 4 this weekend, called "When the Moors Ruled Spain". She stated categorically that
the name Al-Andalus was simply Arabic for '(Land) of the Vandals', Vandal being another name for Visigoth.
From ANDALUCIA (Spain) .... you are Right DJCrabtree ...this is what this word mean :simply Arabic for '(Land) of the Vandals ..... correct  |
Oud Player
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al-Halabi
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Medieval Muslims used the name al-Andalus to refer to the Iberian lands under Muslim rule. It appears on coins as early as 716, that is, five years
after the beginning of the Muslim invasion of the Iberian Peninsula. The most widely accepted explanation for the origin of the word al-Andalus is
that it refers to the land of the Germanic Vandals, who passed through the region in the fifth century on their way to North Africa. This explanation
is not accepted as conclusive, though. Some scholars find it puzzling that the Arabs should have named the area after a people who were long gone from
there.
The Spanish Andalucia derives from al-Andalus, but is a Spanish form, similar to Valencia, Galicia, Murcia, etc. It looks like the Arabic feminine
adjective meaning Andalusian (andalusiyya), but that's a coincidence.
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billkilpatrick
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i understood that it was the stated aim of the more extreme muslim ... expansionists(?) ... to one day reclaim al-Andalus. i too find it peculiar
that the place would be named after a marauding horde, just passing through.
this is not intended to be a loaded question: are there vandal (ethnic) traces in the maghreb population today?
i rather like my "land where the sun sets" definition of the word but i can see that it won't stand up.
- bill
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al-Halabi
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The Vandals actually disappeared from the North African population as a distinct ethnic group not long after they were defeated by the Byzantines in
533 and lost all their North African possessions. The members of the royal family were taken to Constantinople, and those warriors who were not killed
were also taken to the Byzantine capital to become part of a special cavalry force fighting on behalf of the Byzantines. Of the relatively small
Vandal population left behind, those who survived and were not taken into slavery were soon absorbed into the indigenous North African population and
disappeared as a separate group.
There was no serious military effort on the part of Muslims to reconquer al-Andalus after its final fall in 1492, even though the loss generated a
Muslim tragic literature of mourning and nostalgia for the golden age of Islamic Spain. Muslims had to accept this retreat on their western frontier
with Christendom. There was a measure of consolation for them in the fact that Muslims were being successful at that very time against the Christians
on their eastern frontier, where Ottoman rule was expanding deep into Christian southeastern Europe as far north as Hungary. That was a major success
story which shifted the focus of attention eastward to the new frontiers of Muslim expansion.
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