zalzal
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Omar Naqishbendi VS Riad el Sunbati en Maqam Rast
I think Omar Naqishbendi is the winner.....
http://www.mikeouds.com/audio/arabesques/omarn/track_1_omar_naqshab...
http://www.mikeouds.com/audio/real/sunbati_taqsim_rast.rm
BTW is Riad el Sunbati oud a nahat as well ??
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oudman
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Omar Naqishbendi would have to be born again to beat Sunbati 
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SamirCanada
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I like Riad el Sumbati better for that taqasim. Just because I think the one by Omar sounds like its much more rehearsed. Riad is just going at it
freestyle and the modulations are awe inspiring.
Also I think that he played with both a Nahat and George Gamil oud.
I dont think its possible to juge great players like that by who wins and who looses. Its music its just about wich one makes your hair raise and
gives you shivers when you listen. You cant give points on that.
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Elias
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Hello Guys!
Usually i prefer Naqishbendi,but for that taqasim...well it's an hard choice maybe for thist Rast could win Sunbati...i agree with Samir that it's
impossible to choice the better one, and each one of us fell both musicians in different ways,...and expecially taking just one taqasim played on a
maqam.....
...personally the notes played by Naqishbendi gives me always more emotions than Sunbati...but sunbati is very intelligent and inspired with the
modulations....
..also if i find both the two far away from Saliba Qatrib...
About the ouds I could say that they are both Nahats..but when i mean Nahat...I mean "Abdo" Nahat...not just a Nahat...;-)
Salamat
Elias
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zalzal
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Agree with you, no way to judge one against the other, this is just a way to wake up our comments, and i appreciate yrs very much, it give me tools to
"read" again both taqasims, fm different points of view.
For me Riad played too gorgeously and his modulation took him somehow out of the rast with a however rich and imaginative melody line. Also he
"abused" with the tremolo.
For me Omar Naqishbendi remained very and even totally rast. With his sober way of touching each note and his dosed amount of tremolo, he "makes
my hair raise and gives me shivers".
In any case both styles are similar, both ouds seems to be Nahat, both players are contemporains, i think, both taqsims have similar timing and
duration, similar phrases, similar attacks, similar spirit and feeling.
SAME TARAB
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Elias
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YEs zalzal!......also Naqiasbendi makes here modulations, but less "imposed"and calculated respect to Riad ones......You touched the most imprtant
point that my little and personal opinion makes me prefer Naqishbendi...his spirit when playing,......Also Riad has lot of soul but what to
say!...Omar gives me shiver with 1/10 of the notes made by Riad....That's the hard point, to be so expressive with so little help from technic end
tremolos ecc.ecc.....and this opinion comes right from me, wich i usually play a lot of notes in taqasim and solos....
By the way we are just trying to find some differences..but as you say this musicians are very close.....
These are the great masters, from each one of them we have to learn always so much, Only listen carefully to all of them,Saliba Qatrib,Naqishbendi,
RIad, Qassabji, Munir, ecc.ecc. we can fully understand the beauty and the soul of this instrument that we all in this forum love so much, we can
prefer one or another but i think we have to follow them all! :-))
Salamat
elias
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SamirCanada
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Dont forget that the Riad recording is of lower quality it seems. It makes a difference.
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Elias
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YEs, it's important..but i was not referring to this particular recording..but talking in general in the intense and very deep playing of Omar i find
much more soul, and that's only my opinion and my taste!....if you listen to the rare and old Saliba Qatrib recordings, the quality of the recording
is just comical and funny: poor quality, noises of glasses and voices and clacsons from the streets ecc....but you can listen to his unique and never
reached playing,touch and soul like he was recording in a professional studio!....by the way it's only my point of view!;-)
Salamat
Elias
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oudmaker
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I am not an arabic musician. But I can't help myself to give an opinion about these two taksims. They are both most beautiful oud taksims that I heard
in Arabic music.
I vote for Nakshibendi. First He has a deep knowledge of Rast. He knows how to spend his melodies which he has in his soul. Step by step, word by
word, sentence by sentence fills me of Rast. Calculated, relaxed, with a lot of confidance He introduces different makams without trying to show off
which he does not need at all. His istifs are excellent. I heard a beautiful Suzinak a beautiful Mahur and Segah plus some Arabic makams which I am
not familiar.
Thank you Zalzal.
Dincer
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Jameel
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I like both. But for different reasons. Sunbati is by far more advanced musically than Naqshbendi. Listen to this taqasim by Sunbati:
http://www.mikeouds.com/audio/real/sunbati_taqsim_ashwaq.rm
This is simply an incredible taqasim. Is there a maqam expert here that can explain what is happening in this taqasim? This is one of my all-time
favorites, since it has such an epic quality, full of imagery. I love it.
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oudmaker
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I fully agree Jameel. It is just incredible as you said. I would like to add: it is just unbelievable. I also agree that he is far more advanced
musically than Nakshibendi if the comperison is done between Sunbati's this Nihavend taksim with Nakshibendi's Rast taksim above. I loved both of
them.
Thank you Jameel for this beauty
Regards
Dincer
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Elias
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Yes, this Ashwaq is from time one my Sunbati's favourites taqasim, really evocative...he works so nicely with nahawand and i also like his Bayat...
Of course Sunbati was amore advanced than Omar, but fo this reason, being Naqishbandi self-teached his music was pure soul...
ELias
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oudman
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I agree with Jameel as well, Sunbatis nahwand taqasim before ashwaq is one of my personal favorites as well. Sunbati didnt have awesome technique
(like Farid for example) but he had so much music in him. He was able to show many colors in the same maqam and his modulations were innovative and
brilliant. Sunbati is probably my favorite arabic oud player (and composer). Saliba al Qatrib was a brilliant oud player and singer as well.
I didnt like Omar as much because he is not a clean player (he plays plenty of notes off) which I think really disrupts the flow of the taqasim.
Ill try to break down the taqasim for you Jameel
Nahawand A
1:18 Bayati E
1:58 hinting Rast A
2:21 return to nahawand A
2:34 bayati E
2:40 saba E
3:21 back to bayati E
3:29 back to nahawand A
3:38 Bb accidental (hint to lami)
4:07 (can be ajam on C) then back to nahawand A high register
5:07 hijaz E
5:18 nawa athar A
5:45 nahawand murassa A
6:00 rast A
7:00 hijazkar E, nawa athar A
7:37 kurd A
8:08 closes nahawand A
8:10 back to kurd A
9:04 bayati E (emphasises the rast A tetrichord below a few times)
9:55 return to nahawand A (Bb accidental 10:10)
I did this without an oud so I hope i didnt make any mistakes
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JT
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Hey Guys,
I cant believe this is a topic. Both taqasims are great and both players are exceptional. I dont think you can judge who is better or not. Things can
appeal to different listeners and its a matter of personal taste.
I think both taqasims can be appreciated, and we can learn alot from both of these great legends.
Music is not about who is better or not, its soul enriching- not a competition.
Cheers,
JT
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zalzal
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JT, of course, "tabaan", no way to judge one against the other, (as i said before) this is just a way to prod all of us to wake up our comments,
our critical analysis, our technical opinions.
As i found lot of similarities while listening to both taqsims, sound, soul, timing, phrases, style etc i thoght the best way to have more of yr
technical and musical explanations was to put them together.
And i think the result has largely matched my expectations.
As i am just a begginner, i have learnt a lot fm you all reading yr comments.
Thank you all again for yr extremely useful, technical and high level critical comments
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