billkilpatrick
Oud Junkie
Posts: 563
Registered: 1-3-2004
Location: italy
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sting dowland cd
not an oud related topic but ... the lute list has tolerated my oud chat for a very long time and i'm very curious to know how european lute music is
appreciated here - if at all (especially when sung and performed by sting - with lute accompaniment by edin karamazov):
anyone heard the "songs from the labyrinth" album? ... sting's recordings of music by john dowland?
... any comments?
- bill
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adamgood
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Location: Brooklyn, NY
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i listened to some of the samples at iTunes.
first let me say that I don't know anything about the music of John Dowland. Other than that, from the little I've heard I think he wrote beautiful
songs.
I also don't know squat about lute playing and i think the lute player sounds great.
I do know the Police and Sting's music since I grew up on it. I love the Police still, think they were an awesome and original band. really creative
with their sounds, energy, great guitar playing, cool singing. but, i think the CD of Sting singing Dowland songs just sounds dumb. sumthin's missing
there. These are not "hard" songs, they're simple but therein lieth the beauty. I don't know why i bring this up but do you know the singer Nick
Drake? Imagine him singing these songs and that's maybe what i would like to hear. simple delivery, normal 20th century tongue.
there's a difference between "pet project" and "artistic statement" and I say, why go in one direction over the other?
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David Parfitt
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Just had a listen on Sting's website, and have to say this is utter tosh. No doubt it will shoot straight to No.1 in the "classical" charts though,
and will be followed by Bono on harpsichord and Puff Daddy on crumhorn, just in time for Christmas.
I imagine Sting's diary must look something like this:
MONDAY: Save the rainforest.
TUESDAY: Master the lute.
WEDNESDAY: Take car in for service.
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SUNDAY: Rest.
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Ronny Andersson
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| Quote: | Originally posted by billkilpatrick
not an oud related topic but ... the lute list has tolerated my oud chat for a very long time and i'm very curious to know how european lute music is
appreciated here - if at all (especially when sung and performed by sting - with lute accompaniment by edin karamazov):
anyone heard the "songs from the labyrinth" album? ... sting's recordings of music by john dowland?
... any comments?
- bill |
Yes I have Billy and it is a piece of crap, Sting should really stick to his own music. I belive Morrissey would make a much better interpretation and
least have more pleasant voice for Dowlands songs and lyrics.
Is there any better recording than Alfred Dellers?
Long live the countertenors !
Ronny
Best wishes
Ronny
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jdowning
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Registered: 8-2-2006
Location: Ontario, Canada
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I admire the efforts of someone prepared to creatively explore wider musical fields - my only concern is that there might be a danger of this effort
being regarded as a definitive performance of Dowland by those unfamiliar with the lute song repertoire - which of course it is not!! There are many
superb performances of Dowland available to choose from by professional performers specialising in this field.
Sting's untrained voice is not convincing for this repertoire and he seems to be trying too hard to be expressive. Nevertheless his diction is OK in
places and his lutenist sounds pretty accomplished - although an arch lute is not the instrument that Dowland wrote for.
So - interesting - but not a record that I will be adding to my 'early music' collection!!
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Ararat66
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1025
Registered: 11-14-2005
Location: Portsmouth, UK
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There is no real danger here ... not really - no one is being smashed by bombs, its just that a real person you only know as a musical myth is
demonstrating an interest in a musical field that is maintained by efficionados. The fear seems to be that a so called 'lesser' sensibiity may poison
the purity of the very special musical sensitivities of experts and enthusiasts.
Well then probably a lot of us on this forum would come under this banner. I am no celebrity by any stretch of the imagination but I am certainly a
relative beginner to the oud (doing pretty well under the circumstances - doing my best) and cannot anywhere near match the depth of knowledge of many
of you - but I feel music as deeply as anyone and will not assume that others, beginners or experts, do not do the same.
This applies to Sting as well. I am no Sting fan but if it rains on him he would feel wet just like me. Deriding his work as 'utter tosh' smacks of
an unskillful archer aiming at an easy target. This dehumanises Sting and reinforces the notion of him as simply a faceless construct - it just goes
to further strengthen this illusion of celebrity.
Are you telling us that he simply must stick to being this and never express interest in other forms of music - even that of the hallowed lute?
For those of you who know the nuances of this music your knowledge is well respected and certainly appreciated. Some of your assumptions about your
less knowledgable sentient beings is not so welcome.
Anyway, look, I'll try to leave a helpful and contrite thought from the very well known, and startlingly insightful Zen monk Shunryu Suzuki "In the
beginner's mind there are many possibilities, but in the expert's there are few". I am really appealing for a little compassion and empathy.
Best regards
Leon
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jdowning
Oud Junkie
Posts: 3485
Registered: 8-2-2006
Location: Ontario, Canada
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Zen monk, beginner or "expert", musical appreciation is simply a matter of personal taste and preference - like food, drink and love.
If you like it - go for it - if you don't, move on to other more interesting things.
As a performer, I have no doubt that Sting likely does not care that his admirable efforts are not fully appreciated by everyone on this forum or even
on the planet. Such is the lot of the professional artist!
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John Erlich
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1470
Registered: 8-26-2004
Location: California, USA
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Mood: Oud-Obsessed
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On the subject of lute and early music, as with Middle Eastern music and jazz, I am very much the traditionalist, finding most forms of "fusion" music
tacky.
In general, I have conflicting feelings about fusion music efforts such as Sting's. One the one hand, he is giving exposure jazz and "ethnic"
musicians that they wouldn't otherwise receive and their audience might broaden as a result. On the other hand, like most non-pop-music performers, I
have a gut reaction of irritation at the success of pop musicians, most of whom have musical skill levels way below the average performer of jazz and
classical musics.
I haven't heard the album in question, but will try the samples on Amazon.com tomorrow: http://www.amazon.com/Songs-Labyrinth-Sting/dp/B000HXDESU
For traditional lute music, I want to put in a good word for Jacob Heringman (whose brother happens to be married to my wife's cousin):
http://www.heringman.com/
All the best,
John
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