doctorrockter
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Location: Euskirchen, Germany
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Recommendation for good affordable ouds
Hi,
I am in search for a good affordable oud. I am a 30-year-old German musicologist as well as professional musician, songwriter and producer running his
own recording studio and label. I write and release music in so different genres like Metal, Fusion, Blues, atonal orchestral music, New Age,
HipHop/RnB and commercial Pop/Dancefloor. Currently I am working on a brandnew Arab Pop Music-production and I want to include real oud sounds. Of
course, I have numerous oud sounds in all of my synthesizers (Korg, Roland and the likes) but as great as those synths are, when it comes to guitar
sounds they are just not good enough. Also the fretlessness of a real oud will add the right flavour to the melody other than a synth. My aim is to
use the oud for small melody lines, not for a 20-minute-solo. We are talking music like let's say Amr Diab, Samira Said and the likes..
Now my question: Where can I buy a good, quality-built but affordable oud in Central Europe (Germany, Switzerland, Austria, Belgium,
France, Netherlands, Scandinavia)??
Is there anything special I should watch out for?
On Ebay there is only one special brand that offers lots of new ouds called CEM. Their ouds range from 170 EUR up to 340 EUR. What do you think of
this brand? Any experiences with their products?
Here are some auctions..
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=310160078192&...
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=310160300452&...
http://cgi.ebay.de/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=310213914342&...
I realized that oud prices are way less expensive than those for electric guitars. For a professional electric guitar I am used to pay around $1200 -
$2000. But the ouds that I see on Ebay seem to be a lot cheaper. Is that right? So any recommendation?
Thanks a lot and take care
Doc Rock;-)
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
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There is a search function in this forum. Pls read the hundreds of posts on this basic subject.
Cheap ouds exist but like in guitars if you can afford a $1000 to $2500 instrument you will be better off.
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doctorrockter
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Any comments on the links I posted?
I was forwarded to you all by Mike.. so that's why I did an extra post..
"Without music life would be a mistake." [Nietzsche]
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fernandraynaud
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You must understand that we are bombarded with the same questions over and over, three times today alone, though we have answered them in great detail
many times. Note that I'm the only one answering. There was a report some time ago on a CEM oud, but nobody here knows about their offerings du jour.
It's like any instrument, there is a vast body of information - would you expect a simple answer if someone asked what the best guitar or violin to
purchase was?
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doctorrockter
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I just expect - as written in bold letters - a recommendation on where to a good oud in central Europe. Mike said that here are lots of European
people. So I expect someone to just give me some names.. of stores.. or brands... Nothing more, nothing less... Just names of addresses where to buy
and where definitely NOT to buy..
"Without music life would be a mistake." [Nietzsche]
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charlie oud
Oud Junkie
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Hey Fernandraynaud , chill.
 Welcome to the forum Doc. The ouds you posted look good for the price. The
things you really need to look out for are 1) the action. If the action is too high the oud will be difficult to play. 2) the pegs. If the pegs do not
hold firm the oud will be difficult to keep in tune.
After this then it really comes down to the sound you are after. I think the first 2 ouds would be ok for the purposes you mentioned, the 3rd one
looks a little too cheap, like for a complete beginner. Then again you may get lucky and the cheaper oud could sound better.
If you go for any of the ouds you posted they are Turkish so remember not to tune turkish with an arabic string set as this is will give too much
tension. I hope this helps. Keep looking on the forum for ouds for for sale there are always some for sale here.
Best Wishes, Charlie
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doctorrockter
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@ charlie oud:
Thanks man!!
Now THAT's what I expected. Simple question, simple answer. 
Yes I want the arabic sound. I have, of course, read about the different tunings and will be carefully. It's just that I do not want to buy complete
trash. Just a "good enough" oud. Only for recording purposes.
Ok, thanks a lot bro!!
"Without music life would be a mistake." [Nietzsche]
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charlie oud
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Also doc I think you will find more choice with private sale or shops outside of europe. Have a look at arabinstruments.com you will find on the links
page on this forum it is the last link on the page.
Best Wishes, Charlie
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fernandraynaud
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What Charlie says involves a complex issue. There are a lot of factors that can make a badly made oud that is hard to play sound divine. On a one
shot recording project you can put up with a lot that you cannot tolerate if you play several hours every day. Bad pegs can be made to hold, and a
high action contributes to that Arabic sound. You can use EQ and DSP to make a dull oud sound alive. So if all you plan to do is cut a few tracks, and
not get into playing "correctly", it probably doesn't matter too much what you get, and that's not being sarcastic.
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charlie oud
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http://www.mikeouds.com/messageboard/viewthread.php?tid=10948
How about this one above in France, may be worth considering ?
Remember to keep with us, you'll find much of interest for your project here on the forum, sound clips professional and amatuer plus some extremely
knowledgeable oud dudes, enjoy and it would be great to hear any recordings you make which have some oud in them. The oud has great potential for use
in many styles
Best Wishes, Charlie
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fernandraynaud
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I like this oud, but Ironically i think this may be too "good" an instrument. It's much easier to lengthen the sustain electronically than shorten it.
If he wants that very percussive Ryad Al Sunbati sound, it's easier to start with less resonance. The thing he doesn't want for sure is a ringy
Turkish, and even the fixed bridge Syrian type may be too sustainy. I'm not joking, a cheap Egyptian may be best for the specific task at hand. The
first oud I ever used was like that, and I am amazed at how well it recorded.
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charlie oud
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Yes Fernand. Thats a good point. Cheap Egyptian ouds often deliver more Arabic flavour than cheap non-Egyptian ouds.
Best Wishes, Charlie
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fernandraynaud
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Doc, here is perhaps a very good example of the quintessential "homesick" Arabic sound. If an oud sounds like that, you can do almost anything with
it, including sounding Turkish, but you can't make a bright zingy oud sound like this. I was just playing some $3000 ouds, and we were talking about
how some of the cheapest ouds sound better, anyway.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XtM52MfsL-k&feature=youtube_gdat...
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doctorrockter
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@fern:
Ok, ok, now.. I guess it's time to point out something:
Look, the oud as I want to use it is meant to play LITTLE lines of a few seconds in the complete arrangement of Arab pop - again - P.O.P. songs. As I
said we are talking music like Amr Diab, Samira Said and the more modern stuff of this region.
I did NOT intent to play incorrectly, did I? You are talking to a professional musician who releases albums worldwide via professional labels in
Spain, Australia or Japan. I am not Quincy Jones but do not tell me that I want to play "incorrectly" only because I ask for a reasonably-priced
oud!!! I was not looking at the cheapo stuff but at the affordable instruments. Nothing less.
I should add: I own around 15 guitars (USA made G&L, Kramer, Ibanez, Fender etc.), basses (rare Schack, Peavey) and acoustics (upper series
Yamaha), up to 10 different amps and preamps as well as 4 - 5 professional synthesizers (Rolands, Korgs) - and those only being my PHYSICAL
instruments. I do not want to talk about the VST's and the studio itself. That does not belong here. But: All these instruments differ from $400
instruments to way more expensive stuff depending on what I use regularly and what is only needed for that "spice" in an arrangement.
So bottom line: Neither is my intention to play incorrectly (or not to respect the whole Arabic world - I should add my girl friend is half-egypian!)
nor is it to study 8 hours a day for fifteen years only to play the oud like Naseer Shamma.
And please take into account: I am a musicologist and guitarist (since 17 years) and as such have definitely lots of insight into music theory. So
understanding the oud and its physics is not a problem at all for me. We are talking about getting into the playing just to such a degree that lets
one record correct and classy oud lines for - again - P.O.P.-arrangements. I do not want to record solo records with the oud. This I do with the
electric guitar only. So I cannot understand the discussion and the stressy ambience you are spreading.
I have no intention to debate here any longer about what I do or compose. I am a musician and composer and just NEED the oud sound in the arrangement.
But I cannot justify paying $1500 for a wonderfull killer oud which only gets used on those Arab Pop productions (which make up 15% of my productions
a year). My main musical sector is Metal , Blues, Fusion, New Age
and German Pop music.
Ok I hope you have understood this now. I needed to point this out as I realize that you are very stressed about oud-newbies asking questions and not
wanting to spend $5000 for the perfect oud. The oud may be YOUR main instrument and so you have YOUR views but for me the main instrument is the
electric guitar. The oud is a great instrument, too, and I will have a lot of fun getting into it just as I did lots of years ago when I started out
on the lapsteel. But: It is only a secondary instrument in my arsenal.
So, please, drop this discussion now as my question has already been answered and you will probably not see another post of mine here on this forum. I
have no time for hanging around here 12 hrs a day. It is just a forum with nice people helping each other - and thanks again to charlie (U rule!)!
So peace up, chill and relax!
Doc
"Without music life would be a mistake." [Nietzsche]
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doctorrockter
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@fern:
THX for your link and final cilled out mood ;-)
"Without music life would be a mistake." [Nietzsche]
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doctorrockter
Oud Admirer
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Location: Euskirchen, Germany
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Of course I meant "chilled out mood"..
I guess our post crossed each other... in the time when I wrote the long one you posted 4 others..
ok thanks again to the both of you!
Rock on or better: OUD on !
"Without music life would be a mistake." [Nietzsche]
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Brian Prunka
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Was one of Fernand's posts deleted or something? You seemed to be helpful, and totally undeserving of the obnoxious tirade from DR. I hope he keeps
his promise about not coming back.
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spyros mesogeia
Oud Junkie
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Mood: play my ouds
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fernandraynaud
Oud Junkie
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No, nothing was deleted. Poor "secondary" girlfriend. I wonder what P.O.P. is.
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Matthias
Oud Junkie
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Quote: Originally posted by doctorrockter  | | I just expect - as written in bold letters - a recommendation on where to a good oud in central Europe. Mike said that here are lots of European
people. So I expect someone to just give me some names.. of stores.. or brands... Nothing more, nothing less... Just names of addresses where to buy
and where definitely NOT to buy.. |
Hello,
you should see the oud's from CEM by yourself. They are in Mannheim ~ 250 Km away from you, and make your own judgement. If you are not satisfied, add
230 Km and visit me in Badenweiler. Here you can find absolutely professional instruments made by myself, instruments that will fit to your
profession.
Actually I do have 3 ouds for sale here. To one of this you can listen at youtube:
Raed Koshaba, Bagdad/Aachen http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A9i9uvzpSoQ Badenweiler 2008
interested? Call me or get in contact directly to me by U2U or through my website.
regards
Matthias
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charlie oud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 694
Registered: 11-19-2007
Location: Newcastle upon tyne. UK
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Mood: chords prefer frets
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Hey Doc,
You may enjoy checking out Roman Bunka former German rocker now seriously good oud player. His collaborations over the years have used the oud to
great effect in various styles. I know you are not seeking alot but this guy may well be interested in what you're up to. His collaborations with
Egyptian pop star Mohammed Munir include some fine lines of oud playing by Roman. Search Roman bunka and his site will come up.
Best Wishes, Charlie
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