Zulkarnain
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Mahagony VS Walnut
Hi
Need to find out which type of wood is better in quality, durability and appearance between this 2 wood, Mahogany or Walnut. This is to use as a rib
for the back of the Oud (Bowl)
Appreciate any thoughts and comments!
Salam
Zulkarnain
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walkad
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I say with no doubt, walnut rules! Much better sound quality and apperance. When it comes to durability I am not sure if there are difference to
mahogny.
By the way Foad Jihad has a great stock of walnut from northern iraq. He have a huge tree that he stored since the early sexties, and its enough for
all his coming ouds.
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Haluk
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Mahagony-Walnut combination will be better than only Mahagony or Walnut.
Regards.
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walkad
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Haluk, Zul was asking about the bowl. I guess you mean the bowl of walnut and the neck of mahogny might be as good as walnut only (although I really
doubt that)
Puting the mahogny in the bowl doesnt produce better sound, because of the mahognys high density (heavier).
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Zulkarnain
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Hi
Thanks Walkad and Haluk for the comments-hope to hear more from you guys and also other members!
Salam
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Stefan Andalus
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I was once told by a physicist, who was also a fine lute player, that the wood of the bowl does not matter at all to the sound, as long as the wood is
a hardwood. It is the face-soundboard that matters more than anything else - usually very fine-grained spruce. Some of the great oud-makers found
wonderful wood for soundboards by using soundboard spruce from fine old pianos. Most of the eBay ouds advertise fancy wood for the bowl, but the
soundboard is cheap pine with heavy coats of cheap plastic varnish. Horrible, weak sound!
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Ronny Andersson
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Stefan Andalus
>I was once told by a physicist, who was also >a fine lute player, that the wood of the bowl >does not matter at all to the sound, as long
>as the wood is a hardwood.
That's not true. I'm a musician and I can hear any subtle differences in sound. Just ask the oudmakers Fawzy Monshed, Yaroub Fadel and Foad
Jihad and they tell you the same. It's the ears that counts. |
Best wishes
Ronny
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Ronny Andersson
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| Quote: | Originally posted by walkad
Haluk, Zul was asking about the bowl. I guess you mean the bowl of walnut and the neck of mahogny might be as good as walnut only (although I really
doubt that)
Puting the mahogny in the bowl doesnt produce better sound, because of the mahognys high density (heavier). |
Yaroub said that mahogny has inferior soundquality and that's why his ouds of mahogany have a lower price .
Best wishes
Ronny
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Stefan Andalus
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Hey, Ronny - in my usual name as Steve Bayne(who you know) I've been a classical composer for thirty years, with as fine an ear as anybody in the
world. I'd love to set up an experiment in which there are two ouds, made exactly the same EXCEPT for bowl wood, played behind a curtain. I
would ask a group of really fine musicians to judge which has an "oak" sound, and which has a "mahogany" sound. Just the way you
judge fine wines. Or Swedish lutefisk versus Norwegian lutefisk.That would really be the way to tell who is right. Yes? And it would be fun. Yes?
Cheers and regards to you, my friend!
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Zulkarnain
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Thanks guys!
The Mahagony or Walnut issue is regarding the Ribs (bowl) of the Oud, either to have all Mahagony strips with Sycamore as spacer or to have all Walnut
strips with Ebony as spacer?
Sound wise, Im not sure how much these 2 type of woods will contribute the most, I have an Oud using all Mahagony for the ribs but never experience
Walnut in this case.
Thanks for helping!
Salam
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Ronny Andersson
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Stefan Andalus
Hey, Ronny - in my usual name as Steve Bayne(who you know) I've been a classical composer for thirty years, with as fine an ear as anybody in the
world. I'd love to set up an experiment in which there are two ouds, made exactly the same EXCEPT for bowl wood, played behind a curtain. I
would ask a group of really fine musicians to judge which has an "oak" sound, and which has a "mahogany" sound. Just the way you
judge fine wines. Or Swedish lutefisk versus Norwegian lutefisk.That would really be the way to tell who is right. Yes? And it would be fun. Yes?
Cheers and regards to you, my friend! |
o la la, Steve I'm glad it was the physicist words and not yours!.
well lets do the test...
Best wishes
Ronny
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Elie Riachi
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If you guys do the test, it might be better to completely darken the stage or blindfold the listeners instead of having the oudist behind curtains so
not to affect the sound travel by the curtains. Just a suggestion.
Elie
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Zulkarnain
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So elie what do prefer for the bowl?
Salam
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Elie Riachi
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Marhaba Zul,
Most likely Walnut.
Take care,
Elie
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Zulkarnain
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Hi
Thanks Elie and any special reason for that choice?
Hey Ronny, you didnt make your comment yet
Salam
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Elie Riachi
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Hi Zul,
It is my impression that walnut is the wood of choice for making musical instruments. Comparing it to mahagony, walnut is harder. Mahagony is more
textured and that may make it harder to get a smoother surface compared to walnut and especially when bent I would think and I am not an expert. If
you have access to these woods which the oud will be made of, you can tap the boards and listen to the sound they make and decide which sound you like
best. It seems like I read this test somewhere and thinking about, it simply makes sense.
Take care,
Elie
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Ronny Andersson
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| Quote: | Originally posted by Zulkarnain
Hi
Thanks Elie and any special reason for that choice?
Hey Ronny, you didnt make your comment yet
Salam |
For Bashir ouds made by Fawzy,Yaroub and Foad I prefer the Indian rosewood species Dalberiga sissoo resp. latifolia. Fawzy is the only maker, from
what I know who take the sapwood of sissoo. His ouds sound and lightness is interesting. A combination of rosewood and walnut is ok too.
For classical ouds then I would choose walnut. I'm not much for mahagony and ebony.
Best wishes
Ronny
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Zulkarnain
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Hi Elie
Thanks for clear it up for me! Appreciate it!
Salam
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samzayed
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From what I heard, Rosewood gives a darker, more sustained sound, while walnut gives a lighter, mellow sound. It seems like a joining these 2 woods
in a bowl would contradict each other's characteristics. Am I wrong on this? Can someone tell why rosewood and walnut are often married
together?
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Ronny Andersson
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| Quote: | Originally posted by samzayed
From what I heard, Rosewood gives a darker, more sustained sound, while walnut gives a lighter, mellow sound. It seems like a joining these 2 woods
in a bowl would contradict each other's characteristics. Am I wrong on this? Can someone tell why rosewood and walnut are often married
together? |
I know that Yaroub prefer bowls of Indian rosewood for the Bashir oud. I prefer also rosewood when the projection is better and
a ¨better¨ sound is obtained. I played on one Bashir oud built with sycamore - the oriental platanus specie - this oud was very weak sounding and
brigth. Really, it was not much louder than some classic oud that I tried. Also what's very interesting is that in Iraq are makers using a
different Rosewood specie that maybe produces a different sound. At least Fawzy's Bashir oud is made of the sapwood which is softer than the
heartwood. I know Sam, that ouds with a bowl made of rosewood and walnut sound excellent if it's from a good maker.
Best wishes
Ronny
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Zulkarnain
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Hi
Thanks Sam & Ronny for your comments. It looks like Walnut is more favourable in bowl making for the Oud! How about a Walnut strips with Ebony
spacer?
Salam
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