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mysticoud
Oud Addict
Posts: 35
Registered: 11-5-2003
Location: California
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Mood: YAY!
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Speed and Upstrokes
How does one go about gaining risha speed? I mean like the incredible speed that Simon Shaheen and Naseer Shamma has (just to name a few). Is it just
scale studies and practice?
Also, I feel very hindered by upstrokes and "inside picking". They feel very weak and I often miss at higher speeds. Is this a common weakness for
beginning/intermediate oud players?
If anybody has any tips or Studies, I'd greatly appreciate it. Thanx.
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Jameel
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1672
Registered: 12-5-2002
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I had the same problem until I had a lesson with Simon Shaheen. He showed me a technique that fixes it. Read the last few posts in this thread to read about what he taught me. If there is enough interest here, I can post a video of it. I have been using this technique, and it
really has improved my playing even though I don't practice as much as I should.
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mysticoud
Oud Addict
Posts: 35
Registered: 11-5-2003
Location: California
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Mood: YAY!
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Thanks Jameel, that's exactly what I was looking for.
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Greg
Administrator
Posts: 928
Registered: 7-22-2004
Location: Brisbane, Australia
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Thanks Jameel and Brian for those two really enlightening posts. I had not seen them previously. It is exactly what I need to improve my upstrokes.
Regards,
Greg
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souhail
Oud Addict
Posts: 26
Registered: 1-19-2004
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many thanks jameel for the information and for sharing it. man you are lucky to have Simone as a teacher. i'm learning oud now for more than 3 years
and no teacher told me about this method .
anyway it will be great if you can post a video illustration of what you explained.
Best regards and many thanks again.
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Delucia
Oud Lover
Posts: 18
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Ottawa/Canada
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Mood: Foug il Nakhal
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video video please... save our souls
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eliot
Oud Junkie
Posts: 252
Registered: 1-5-2005
Location: The Gorges
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Mood: Aksak
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even simpler...
I start my personal practices with 10 minutes of up and down strokes on one note. I don't use open strings for this, but rather some fingered note, a
different one every day.
5 minutes of up and down strokes, one stroke per second.
5 minutes of up and down strokes, one pair of up and down per second (two notes per second).
the entire time, I close my eyes and listen for the sound of each note. Can I tell the difference between the up and down strokes? Can I get to a
point when I can't tell the difference anymore? How long can I maintain this state?
After a point of doing this daily (one month, two months... depends on your personal discipline), tremolo automatically comes. Without ever having
practiced fast picking as an exercise.
Quick string crossings present their own challenges - Simon's exercise addresses that. But my feeling is - if you can't even get one note sounding
consistently good, why worry about all the other ones?
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Jameel
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1672
Registered: 12-5-2002
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Eliot has a great practice regimen there. I played violin for 10+ years before oud, and I can tell you that nothing improves technique like
excercises. During my 'ud lesson with Simon Shaheen he mentioned that before performances he plays through the repertoire VERY slowly. Since a few
people asked for the video, I took some time today and encoded it. These are excerpts from an oud lesson I had (it was actually a group lesson w/ two
guys besides me) with Simon Shaheen about a year ago. The first part is the excercise in question. The rest is mainly about maqamat and taqasim. Can
you imagne learning from Simon full time? I think it would be incredible, but also very demanding. This will only be available for a few days since I
don't have much space on my server, so get it while it's hot!
'Ud Lesson
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TruePharaoh21
Oud Junkie
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Location: California, USA
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Hey Jameel. Thanks so much for this great video. Simon is truly talented, and must be a blessing to have as a teacher. My favorite part is right
around 8:30. He's a comedian, this oud player.
It seems as though Mr. Shaheen likes to teach at a considerable speed, and expects a lot from his students as well. In my opinion, this is good
because it forces the student to keep on their toes when they're not with Mr. Shaheen, and so they can keep up the next time around. Granted, I
haven't seen the rest of the lesson, and I don't know how far along he was in teaching all 3 of you when you got to that point. Do you sense that he's
a bit fast in his teaching? I never had an oud teacher, so I don't know what the speed of teaching usually is. Regardless, I think the fact that the
lesson was taped must help tremendously.
Thanks again!
TP21
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Elie Riachi
Oud Junkie
Posts: 582
Registered: 4-9-2004
Location: Kansas
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Mood: Gebran Tueni Lives For Ever, 12-12-05.
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Many thanks for the video Jameel. Simon seems to have good sense of humor. His playing is so fast, precise, smooth and clean. Enjoyed the lessons
and the music.
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revaldo29
Oud Junkie
Posts: 418
Registered: 6-24-2004
Location: Atlanta, Georgia, USA
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Mood: inspired
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Jameel, you are the man. This video is really helpful. I wish someone would pickup this idea of online oud lessons or even make a series of oud videos
in english to ease the learning process. This video accomplishes in 15 minutes what would usually take months for me to learn on my own. Thanx again
Jameel.
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Jameel
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1672
Registered: 12-5-2002
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Mood: No Mood
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| Quote: | Originally posted by TruePharaoh21
Hey Jameel. Thanks so much for this great video. Simon is truly talented, and must be a blessing to have as a teacher. My favorite part is right
around 8:30. He's a comedian, this oud player.
It seems as though Mr. Shaheen likes to teach at a considerable speed, and expects a lot from his students as well. In my opinion, this is good
because it forces the student to keep on their toes when they're not with Mr. Shaheen, and so they can keep up the next time around. Granted, I
haven't seen the rest of the lesson, and I don't know how far along he was in teaching all 3 of you when you got to that point. Do you sense that he's
a bit fast in his teaching? I never had an oud teacher, so I don't know what the speed of teaching usually is. Regardless, I think the fact that the
lesson was taped must help tremendously.
Thanks again!
TP21 |
Yeah, that's a funny part. By the way, that wasn't me asking the question. I don't know who this guy was ( I never met them before),
but he'd been to the Arabic Music Retreat, and he was asking simple questions like why is the dominant of Rast the 5th note? I guess he must have
forgotten his notepad. I tell you, if I ever got to attend the retreat, I'd be recording every second. I should clarify a bit about this lesson. Simon
was in town for a benefit concert, and Tim O'Keefe (a retreater and incredible percussionist and oud player from MN) was kind of enough to organize a
day of lessons with Simon for those who wanted to participate. I was lucky enough to be in town for the day, so I took advantage. It was a group
lesson. You would have to ask Brian Prunka about Simon's teaching style, he would know better than me. I've only had this one lesson. These other two
guys were rank beginners, so I started off by asking about how to improve rishi technique. They didn't even know how to play a half flat/sharp
(including the guy who spent a week at the retreat!) so I think that's why Simon went into some maqam theory. I'll just say that it was a fantastic
hour. His pace was good for me. I'm no expert in maqamat, but the ajnas and dominants have pretty much exact parallels in Byzantine music, which I am
familiar with. Plus, like you I grew up listening to this music at home, so it's pretty much in there anyway, I just have to teach my fat lazy fingers
to play it!
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souhail
Oud Addict
Posts: 26
Registered: 1-19-2004
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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many thanks Jameel
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Mike
Super Administrator
Posts: 1568
Registered: 12-3-2002
Location: California, USA
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Mood: Happy
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Hey Jameelo,
What can I say my man. That was great! Simon is the man.
Whatdya think, let's make March Simon Shaheen month! 
I love that guy!!!
Thanks bud,
Mike
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Jameel
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1672
Registered: 12-5-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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You are all very welcome. I'm glad that others are getting some value from it. It just goes to show that having a teacher is the only way to go, imo.
I learn so much everytime I see my teacher, I can't imagine how I would progress if I saw him more than a couple times per year.
Mike, Simon IS the man. He plays so effortlessly, he's at that place where none of his energy or thought is occupied with technique, but only
expression and creativity. Can you imagine being able to play whatever you want on the oud with the same ease as which you would write or speak?
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elrabee3
Oud Junkie
Posts: 264
Registered: 12-19-2002
Location: Dubai, UAE
Member Is Offline
Mood: in LOVE
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thanks alot Jameel. i saved this thread in my PC so when i will start playing oud, i will use it as a refrence.
u r so lucky to be that good in oud, and to have an oud teacher like Simon.
Jaber
elrabee3@gmail.com
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mavrothis
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1674
Registered: 6-5-2003
Location: NJ/NYC
Member Is Offline
Mood: big band envy
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Hey Jameel,
Thanks so much for sharing your great experience with Simon Shaheen. I really appreciate the opportunity to peek into his teaching and playing
style.
Thanks so much!!
Take care,
mav 
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Delucia
Oud Lover
Posts: 18
Registered: 12-19-2004
Location: Ottawa/Canada
Member Is Offline
Mood: Foug il Nakhal
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Thank you Jameel.. you're the man and I'm so graetful to you. This lesson is a great one and I learned so many things from it. I hope that you can
post more whenever you can.
Thanks a bunch
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chaldo
Oud Junkie
Posts: 295
Registered: 2-13-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: archaic mood
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simon shaheen
thank you so much, this is so nice. We are learning so much.
Once more proven that Shimon shaheen is really a great player and teacher -- Fannan 9 M3alem.
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Alan
Oud Junkie
Posts: 118
Registered: 9-30-2003
Location: Tampa Bay Florida
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mellow Yellow
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Thanks Jameel. It must have been awesome to sit in with Simon for a lesson. The video was a treat and a way to pass on some important tips for
those of us without teachers. Really appreciate it.
Regards,
Alan
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eliot
Oud Junkie
Posts: 252
Registered: 1-5-2005
Location: The Gorges
Member Is Offline
Mood: Aksak
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Jameel, if web disk space and bandwidth is a problem I could host this for you on my server so people can enjoy the clip in the future. Just let me
know if this is of interest.
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Jameel
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1672
Registered: 12-5-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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Thanks fellas. It's my pleasure to share. Simon isn't my teacher though, I just had this one lesson with him.
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habeebkum
Oud Maniac
Posts: 99
Registered: 2-20-2005
Location: newcastle, uk
Member Is Offline
Mood: arab!
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jameel, that was extremely helpful and u have helped me alot with your posts. if anybody else has any more recorded lessons that would save so many
players alot of time learning!!!i have improved so much only because of this site and the inspiration i get from these forums!THANK YOU
ALL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
habeebkum
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hakeem.ram
Oud Junkie
Posts: 107
Registered: 11-28-2005
Location: Singapore
Member Is Offline
Mood: Ouding my time away
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Hi Jameel!
I guess I saw this post kinda late. Can I get the video too?? It doesn't seem to work.
Peace!
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Jameel
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1672
Registered: 12-5-2002
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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Does anyone have this saved for hakeem.ram? I don't have it on my hard drive anymore.
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