journeyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 492
Registered: 12-28-2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario
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intonation
Does anyone have any suggestions for developing accurate intonation on the oud? Players of the violin family practice long tones with the bow to
develop good intonation. Are there some exercises for oud? I have noticed so far that a lot of it is dependent on ear training, which makes sense. If
we can't hear it we cant play it.
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mavrothis
Oud Junkie
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Registered: 6-5-2003
Location: NJ/NYC
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hi. i think one of the best ways is first to tune the oud perfectly, keeping it in tune as you play. then play fingered notes that you can compare
to the lower/higher octaves on open strings. progress by learning the comparative sound of fifths, fourths, thirds, etc.
i think this is a good way to teach your ear what the correct notes sound like.
take care,
mav
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journeyman
Oud Junkie
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Thanks Mav,
That is what I have been doing, so I'll keep at it. Is there a point where the intonation is not an issue, where you can just play and not
think about it? I play with some good string bass players and they say that they are always working at better intonation.
Peace,
Roy
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mavrothis
Oud Junkie
Posts: 1674
Registered: 6-5-2003
Location: NJ/NYC
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Mood: big band envy
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Hi. I think with any instrument you need to work at improving/maintaining your skills all the time. When you miss one day of practice, you need to
work a week or two to get back to where you were.
But, the more you practice and the more experience you have, the more natural everything comes. Spending time with Adel Salameh and seeing his
amazing skill and feeling in his playing, I see how much practice and experience (not just playing experience, but life experience) add to the whole
picture.
In other words, we should always be playing oud!!! hehehe
Take care,
mav 
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journeyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 492
Registered: 12-28-2003
Location: Toronto, Ontario
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Yes, I agree Mav. We should be playing all the time. It would be great. I have been playing jazz guitar for over 25 years and now I feel like a kid
again with the oud. EVERYTHING is a mystery and every bit of oud playing I hear (well almost every bit) sounds amazing to me. It is just like it was
when I was trying to figure out what jazz players were doing. I can see the depth of the musical traditions that have evolved around the oud, and I
see that learning to really play the music involves the same set of parameters. Listening, technique, transcribing some of the improvisations or even
just some phrases of the masters, studying and just playing for the sake of playing. There is something very seductive about the oud though. Sometimes
I have to tell myself to put it down and play the guitar, get ready for a gig or learn a tune that I need to have together. It just feels so good.
Patience.........
Cheers,
Roy
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Brian Prunka
Oud Junkie
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Everyone's suggestions here are good. I'd like to add a few more, from various teachers (oud and cello):
always try to play in tune--you are training your fingers where to go every time you play.
both the position of your finger AND the angle at which it touches the string affect the intonation. It's much easier to play in tune if you
keep the angle consistent and shift the position along the string than if your constantly changing both. So, if you play a note out of tune,
don't correct it by altering the angle of your finger/hand. Move your finger to the correct position.
Also, a good habit is to keep your fingers close to the strings at all times; this is not only good for speed, but keeps them in the right position
for the notes to be in tune.
be aware that wherever your first (index) finger is will determine the intonation of all your fingers. This is why all position shifts should be
thought of in relation to where your first finger is.
note the difference between a finger extension and a position shift; i.e., a finger extension (even with the first finger) keeps all the fingers in
position except the one being extended. A position shift moves the first finger and all the others proportionally.
I would also suggest, for the ear training part, that you sing along with an open string. Play the open string, and progressively try to sing
unisons, 8vas, P5ths, M3rds, P4ths, m3rds, etc.
Your voice and ear will gravitate toward the correct intonation.
While the quarter-tones and microtonal subtleties take more time & listening, the basic intervals are essentially the same.
A good way of practicing the quarter-tones is to surround them with regular notes. e.g., C D F E1/2b, or D G F E1/2b. This way you have all the other
notes in tune, and can focus on getting the half-flat note. You can repeat the exercise with natural and flat notes, if you want to compare.
I found these suggestions very helpful . . . hope others do, too.
btw, Roy--your experience sounds just like mine. I wonder how many other jazz guitar/oudis are out there?
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wfspark
Oud Junkie
Posts: 166
Registered: 3-7-2004
Location: San Antonio Texas
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Mood: Oud entranced!
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Another guitarest/beginning oudest!
| Quote: | Originally posted by Brian Prunka
Everyone's suggestions here are good. I'd like to add a few more, from various teachers (oud and cello):
always try to play in tune--you are training your fingers where to go every time you play.
both the position of your finger AND the angle at which it touches the string affect the intonation. It's much easier to play in tune if you
keep the angle consistent and shift the position along the string than if your constantly changing both. So, if you play a note out of tune,
don't correct it by altering the angle of your finger/hand. Move your finger to the correct position.
Also, a good habit is to keep your fingers close to the strings at all times; this is not only good for speed, but keeps them in the right position
for the notes to be in tune.
be aware that wherever your first (index) finger is will determine the intonation of all your fingers. This is why all position shifts should be
thought of in relation to where your first finger is.
note the difference between a finger extension and a position shift; i.e., a finger extension (even with the first finger) keeps all the fingers in
position except the one being extended. A position shift moves the first finger and all the others proportionally.
I would also suggest, for the ear training part, that you sing along with an open string. Play the open string, and progressively try to sing
unisons, 8vas, P5ths, M3rds, P4ths, m3rds, etc.
Your voice and ear will gravitate toward the correct intonation.
While the quarter-tones and microtonal subtleties take more time & listening, the basic intervals are essentially the same.
A good way of practicing the quarter-tones is to surround them with regular notes. e.g., C D F E1/2b, or D G F E1/2b. This way you have all the other
notes in tune, and can focus on getting the half-flat note. You can repeat the exercise with natural and flat notes, if you want to compare.
I found these suggestions very helpful . . . hope others do, too.
btw, Roy--your experience sounds just like mine. I wonder how many other jazz guitar/oudis are out there? |
All your suggestions are great so far! I have another Idea for guitar to oud converts. This comes from someone that plays steal
guitar, fretless bass, mandolin, and guitar. The best way is to try and slide up and down the neck verry slowly. This way you are aware of all your
semi tones. Another way to train for pitch is to slide from tonic to octave or tonic to fifth. All of these exercises are designed for neck position
to pitch orientation. Good luck.
William F. Sparks
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