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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
Member Is Offline
Mood: dreaming
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Afghan Rabab, Tanbur and Dotar
Hello,
Listening to Oud was one of the reasons I fell in love with Afghan Rabab. Though they are very different, I hope these are instruments some people
here will love too.
We are working with a master Afghan instrument maker living in Pakistan since the Taliban take over in the 90's. He is building and exporting very
high quality Afghan music instruments.
We are able to provide made to order:
A. Standard Folk Rabab (12 sympathetic strings, 2 drones and 3 main strings.
B. Classical Rabab (13-14 sympathetic strings, 2-3 drones, 3 main strings.)
Rababs are available custom ordered from very plain simnple instruments with no decoration to fully decorated instruments and anything inbetween.
C. Herati Dotar (Similar to those played by Aziz Herawi, 10-13 sympathetic strings and 4-6 main strings)
D. Afghan Dotar (10-13 drone strings and 6 main strings)
E. Afghan Tanbur (very rare 13-15 drone sympathetic strings and 6 main strings)
Dotar and Tanbur can be lightly decorated for with full decoration.
All the instruments are made to order. We have several in our studio in Japan and I am happy to send photos. If you want to learn more we also offer
meetings over Skype if you wish to see and hear them.
We play these instruments in our project and can guarantee that better examples of true Afghan instruments are not available.
Lastly, we help sell these instruments to help promote Central Asian music and study. Our margin is very small so the vast majority of the profits
benefit the instrument makers and help preserve the art of making these instruments.
If you are interested please get in touch.
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michoud
Oud Junkie
Posts: 383
Registered: 6-2-2006
Location: Spain
Member Is Offline
Mood: in the mooud again..
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Hi!
I have an old afghan rabab, and I need to repair it.
Have you got the pegs for sell(I need to change all of them) ?
And have you gt bridges, and strings for sell??
Thanks in advance
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
Member Is Offline
Mood: dreaming
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Parts
I will ask the maker if he can provide parts. At present we are not selling parts alone. Can you send me a message with your email address? I may
need photos of your instrument and measurements to determine peg size etc.. since there is quite a lot of variation in sizes.
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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A little more about these instruments.
Rabab are made with fine selected Mulberry wood. Most Rabab are not finished or coated with any finish. As the instruments age, they will darken from
a yellowish newly completed look to a deeper shade over time.
Some Rabab are finished with a very light clear stain when the user is located in a more humid area. My classical Rabab has this modest sheen to help
protect it from moisture.
Our Tanbur and Dotar are both finished with a soft brown stain. While older instruments are most often unfinished, the maker we work with prefers to
complete with a modest stain. It is also possible to order these without stain or with your own specifications.
Herati Dotar are most often unfinished. My personal instrument again has a modest coat to help protect it in Japan's wet weather. But our client's
instruments have been unfinished.
Other Afghan instruments are available on request.
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
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Mood: Mahoor
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Interesting.
I am actually building a robab (rabab) as you say. I am going with a wooden top to see what it will sound like out. I not carving logs or anything. I
am approaching it like a guitar.
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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Dear Peyman,
I would love to hear and see what you come up with. Are you building it in Afghan style or one of the other types?
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
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Mood: Mahoor
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It's a Persian style, which is somewhat new, even though technically robabs were very popular in Iran in the old days. The one I am working on has a
long neck with frets which encompasses at least 2 octaves (3 main strings, 8 sympathetic). Think lavta. I got the idea after reading about the way
they make robabs in Iran withouth carving logs which tends to waste lots of wood. This method is like guitar building. I still don't know how they
strengthen the body for installing the skin head. That's why I am using all wood for now.
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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Very interesting! I have been very curious about the Persian Rabab after seeing one in some ensemble piece videos. It inspired us to mix our Persian
Santoor with Afghan Rabab for some pieces we are now playing. That combination is truly amazing.
I would love to see photos if you have a chance.
Peyman, maybe you can give us some advice. We are trying to Japan-proof a Persian Tar. The humidity makes my nice instrument unplayable from June to
September. We have a damaged instrument that we are thinking to rework to fit Japan.
A local Shamisen maker is recommending we use Shamisen skin which is fairly weather resistent, but I think the skin may be too thick and may change
the sound too much. So we are searching to find out if an artificial skin may be possible.
Do you have any experience working on Tar? The same question may apply for a practice Rabab for outdoor playing in Japan.
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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Peyman-san, One other question. Do you know where we might be able to see or buy a traditional Persian Rabab? I would love to check one out.
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
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Mood: Mahoor
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I have had the same problems. I gave up playing the Tar. I replaced the skin several times and realized it was futile. It hindered practice. Where I
live, humidity changes alot too. I wish I had a solution but I don't. The skin has to be very thin or you won't get the right sound. Synthetics might
work but how would you attach them? If you figure out, let me know. They don't have this problem in Iran because the weather doesn't have sudden
changes in humidity.
There was a guy on ebay that used to sell those robabs. They looked low quality. But the best I have seen is by the Mohammadi brothers. Same guys that
make the Barbat. I have their phone number somewhere. I haven't talked to them so I couldn't tell you anything else. I have pictures of thier robabs
though. They look beautiful. If you want I can send you an email. U2U me your email!
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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I saw a Tar on sale once with a skin very similar to plastic daf drum skin and glued on just like a normal skin. But not sure what kind of adhesive
they used.
Anyone got any ideas?
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Asaf Zar
Oud Admirer
Posts: 6
Registered: 2-16-2009
Location: New York
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Mood: No Mood
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Afghan Rabab, tanbur and Dotar
Hello Thoind,
I had emailed you and did not get a response.
I have asked for information on the maker and photos of the instruments he makes.
Can you reply to me?
I also want to know his background and as for my other question, I can see you writing about the Mulberry below,
I have lived in Japan ( Tokyo) for many years and never had any problem with my Tar and the humidity. I keep a dehumidifier running in the summer
months and also keep the instrument in a hard case when I am not playing it.
As for Mulberry, it should never be paint or stained, makers stain it only for the colour and to mask the quality of the mulberry, it never adds any
protection or improves the tone.
Without paint or stain, a buyer can tell much about the quality of the instrument, judging from the grain and colour, we can tell where it came from
and age. A maker of integrity would not stain his mulberry, as it only points out the low quality of the wood.
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
Member Is Offline
Mood: dreaming
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Dear Asaf Zar,
I relized today that the email attached to this account isn't working properly. Please email: tokyogr39@yahoo.com and I will reply as soon as
possible.
I am sending a message to our maker today to ask him to provide details about the source, aging and quality of the Mulberry he uses. I should have an
answer in a few days and will post it here.
About Tar. We have been able to keep our home studio dry as well with no problems to the skin. However once we go out to an event the conditions are
harder to control.
Moisture resulting from airconditioning and from poor ventilation have made our Tar unreliable during summer months. The current Tar we have was
obtained for us by an advisor to our group who studied in Iran for several years. It is very high quality and sings when in normal conditions. But
sadly the moisture here causes it to be unreliable during summer.
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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Also. If you send your email address to the address I listed I will send you photos of the Rababs we have in stock. My partner took some very good
photos of the unstained wood so you can see the wood quality.
We have a Herati Dotar arriving in a week or so, I will post photos of that to you as well once it is here.
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Asaf Zar
Oud Admirer
Posts: 6
Registered: 2-16-2009
Location: New York
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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Thanks for your reply, I sent you an email to your other address, please confirm you have received it.
Looking forward to the information and photos.
Asaf Zar
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
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Mood: Mahoor
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Here is a picture of the Persian Robab made by Mohammadi brothers in Esfahan. This instrument has metallic frets (with radif's microtones).
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
Member Is Offline
Mood: dreaming
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Dear Peyman,
This is a very beautiful instrument. Similar and yet so very different than the Afghan cousins.
It reminds me a little of the Uzbek Rabab. We have one that has a similar build but with a little shorter neck and the frets are made in a diatonic
scale.
Is the skin as heavy as the Afghan and Central Asian instruments? Or lighter/thinner like the Persian skinned instruments?
Any idea what a Rabab like the one in the photo would cost? Or if they are obtainable?
Very best wishes,
Tkoind
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
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Mood: Mahoor
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I think it's similar to a Persian Tar. These robabs are used as bass instruments in Persian ensembles (not solo as in Afghan music).
I cant tell you how much it would cost to get one like this. But the cheap ones I have seen run $300-400.
The skin is thick and also tinted red with tea! Also notice that there is a metallic rim that holds the skin down. It gets screwed in place.
Hamnavayan ensemble has the same exact robab here with 15 sympathetic strings:
http://cdbaby.com/cd/hamavayan
Listen to track 4. They make use of the sympathetic strings a lot.
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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Very, very interesting.
We started out as collectors of Central Asian instruments to play in our group. Over the years we have started to provide instruments for others and
now have our buying service. But in the end, it always comes back that we just love these instruments and learning about them.
The two most compelling music traditions for us now are Persian and Afghan music traditions. Sadly there are few opportunities to study here. Instead
we learn whenever opportunties come along. Or, in the near future, we hope to start travelling to study in some of the countries where these
instruments are made and played.
I would love to go to Iran, but our friends living there say it is now very hard to get a visa for US citizens. But we hope to apply. And if possible
search for a couple instruments there. First of all a well made Kurdish Tanboor and second a very well made Setar. But if we can manage to go, I hope
to try to get to see these wonderful makers and locate one of these beautiful Rababs.
If you can put us in touch with the maker, we would love to ask them about buying one.
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
Member Is Offline
Mood: Mahoor
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I sent you a u2u Tkoind.
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Asaf Zar
Oud Admirer
Posts: 6
Registered: 2-16-2009
Location: New York
Member Is Offline
Mood: No Mood
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Peyman,
Would you send me the Mohamadi Brothers of Estafan contact address & number also.
I have two orders into them and have not heard any information back yet.
Thank you
Azaf Zar
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Tkoind
Oud Maniac
Posts: 74
Registered: 7-24-2007
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Mood: dreaming
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Peyman. Thank you. The Persian Rabab is my next target for our collection of Central Asian instruments. The track in the link was wonderful.
My next company project for our instrument shop is to try to put together a comprehensive resource for information for the instruments we play and
sell. Especially tuning instructions, basic technique etc...
The hard part about being in Japan is that there are few resources for learning to play Central Asian instruments. And very few opportunities to
escape the day job long enough to study abroad with masters.
So I am now experimenting with a Rabab teacher to study over video conference a few times a week. So far it is working out ok. I'd love to find other
teachers for different instruments who would be interested in exploring teaching via web cam for people here in Japan who speak enough English to
study.
And of course, we are always looking for ways to bring accomplished players to Tokyo to conduct seminars if we can balance cost with attendance.
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tchandler
Oud Maniac
Posts: 63
Registered: 1-10-2006
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Mood: No Mood
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Hi,
what is a common tuning for the rabab? Does it change depending on the raag?
thanks
tom
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corridoio
Oud Junkie
Posts: 184
Registered: 3-11-2007
Location: Italy
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Hi Tom
the 3 melodic strings (one common choice gut/nylon/nylon) are tuned in fourth
the 2 steel drones strings in fifth, Sa and Pa but I think you could modify Pa when this is not present in some ragas
the 14/15 bronze/steel sympathetic strings tuned in the notes of the raga
I've heard different "sa" tuning from differents recording; (sa=D, C, E, Eb..)
so making an example with sa=C you have:
mel. strings:
Na (note B) (so you have your lower Sa on the first gutfret of the first string)
Ga (note E)
Da (note A)
drone strings:
Sa (note C)
PA (note G)
sympathetic strings:
from Sa of the same octave as over till Sa 2 octave over
So the instruments cover 2 full octaves (and 1 semitone more on the bottom with the first melodic string Na)
Just to understand the indian names for notes:
if Sa=C
ri komal= Db
Re=D
gha komal= Eb
Ga= E
Ma= F
ma tivar= f#
Pa= G
dha komal= Ab
Da= A
ni komal= Bb
Na= B
where komal= flat (b) and tivar= sharp (#)
hope is useful
Ale.
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Peyman
Oud Junkie
Posts: 496
Registered: 7-22-2005
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Mood: Mahoor
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Here is a cool video:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kXuAW5i4Vk0
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