Mike's Oud Forums

Advice on oud buying...in the UK :-)

diane - 3-25-2010 at 06:38 AM

Hi, Postsed this below and had helpful responses but was advised to repost this with reference to the UK in the title, possibilities being so different dependant on location. Sorry for any repetition :-)
Kind regards, Diane

Advice on oud buying


Hello all,
I am hoping to begin my journey with the oud soon. I hope later I will be able to make a trip to Palestine for a week or so, in the mean time I will have to begin closer to home, Wales.
So,...obtaining an oud to work with. I've seen one advertised for £80 - which was less than I expected. I will be a beginner so cannot justify magnificient oud. Though also I do not want to cause myself difficulties through purshasing a poorly made instrument.
I am hoping for advice. How do I know if it is a good oud at a good price? What are the danger/worry things to look for? I have a musical background so with a group of ouds I'm sure I can pick one I prefer, however this will not be the case...just the one oud...
Yes, it would seem wise to take an oud player with me, but those I know of are on far distant shores.
What questions should I be asking? What should I be checking for?
All inputs greatly appreciated,
With kind regards, Diane

Aymara - 3-25-2010 at 08:31 AM

Quote: Originally posted by diane  
Posted this below and had helpful responses ...


... which can be found HERE.

But maybe our UK oud friends might help Diane even more ... where did YOU buy your ouds ... any tips for Diane from Wales?

zakiya_alali - 3-26-2010 at 01:56 AM


Hi,

Well what kind of oud do u have in mind? I have one sukar oud and an iraqi oud. Am based in london. Let me know if you are intersted

Cheers

diane - 3-26-2010 at 01:35 PM

I hope to have a chance to catch up with the mails later tonight. In the meantime, thank you Chris for adding the link :-) I'm quite new to a lot of this.
I'm not sure I know the difference between a sukar and iraq oud. It's certainly Palestinian artists who have caught my attention and Arabic ouds I'm interested in. I'm still learning the words to explain myself, but am getting there, if you can bear with me :-)
Kind regards, Diane

alfaraby - 3-26-2010 at 04:46 PM

Palestinian oud players play Palestinian ouds or ancient Syrian ouds. For example :
Simon Shaheen plays Abdo Nahat's (Damascus)
Taiseer Elias plays Amin Haddad's (Haifa)
Kamil Shajrawi plays Kamil Mowais (Nazareth)
Jubran Trio play's Hatem Jubran's (Nazareth)
Nizar Rohana plays Abdo Nahat & Derpetrossian's (Damascus) & Kamil Mowais's
Adel Salameh plays Abdo Nahat's ......

& I (:)) play Michel Khawam 1929 & 1960 (Aleppo) & Kamil Mowais 1991 & Georgy Hayek 1923 (Aleppo) >

lol

Non of the Palestinian players play an Iraqi oud, nor a Sukkar !!

So get yourself one of these mentioned above, but be willing to pay a lot & I mean a lot

If you want an Egyptian oud, here's Michael Moussa's (UK) site . He's got fixed prices : 1000 $ an oud, no matter which . He's in Darton, Barnsley , South Yorkshire !

http://www.magicstrings.co.uk/index.htm

yours indeed
Alfaraby

Aymara - 3-27-2010 at 01:15 AM

Quote: Originally posted by alfaraby  
For example ...


... Trio Joubran play Joubran ouds. If I remember that correctly, they learned the oud luthery from their father.
Quote:
Non of the Palestinian players play an Iraqi oud, nor a Sukkar !!


Are there any famous professional players regardless of their origin using Sukar ouds ... does he build grand concert ouds, these players usually use? On the other hand I see many professional players using "historic" ouds like Nahat for example.
Quote:
So get yourself one of these mentioned above, but be willing to pay a lot & I mean a lot


I don't think, that it has to be a Palestinean oud. For a beginner every reasonable oud will do a good job, don't you think so? And hey ... once she's infected with the oud virus, she definitely will play every day ... as I do too ;)
Quote:
If you want an Egyptian oud, here's Michael Moussa's (UK) ...


If she can afford it and is shure, she won't give up learning oud, Michael is the man I myself would contact, if I would live in the UK, because first he has a good reputation, and second if Diane will ever encounter a problem, where a luthier is needed, he's the man "nearby".

diane - 3-27-2010 at 02:58 AM

Okay, I still haven't finished reading some of the notes on the thread, but.. Yes, a Joubran oud would be fanastic.. I could neither afford it nor justify its usage as a beginner. Nor justify diverting funds that would otherwise be spent on my children! To answer another question, from before, I play violin, so have some understanding of tone as much as that is transferable across.
It's a good question can I justify and afford an oud from Michael? - it's more than I would have thought I should be entering into/considering...as such a beginner. I'm not looking for an ornate instrument, but one with good tone, I think three openings. I hope to travel to Manchester one Sunday to meet up with the guys there to have my first chance of playing an oud..! I hope also that this journey will help inform me more. Sometimes you can love the sound of an instrument but it suprise you as not feeling 'your instrument' in your hands such as for me ulieann pipes and pibgorn, which I had a chance to play in passing at sessions just for curiousity. I expect I will enjoy the oud very much however for a range of musical reasons but we will see.
Anyhow, I digress! - largely as I need to dash off. I have asked the advice also of my favourite oud player - as to what they would recommend me begin on. They have a wonderful blend of solemnity of beauty and warmth of vibrancy in their playing, but this for sure is a question of their outstanding talent and various influences to date musically and in spirit.
An expensive instrument doesn't take the place of practice/relationship, though a poor one can frustrate this process I understand.
Thank you for all and any future advice.
I will go back later and finish reading the later messages on the other thread.
My warmest regards and appreciation, Diane

Aymara - 3-27-2010 at 03:41 AM

Quote: Originally posted by diane  
I hope to travel to Manchester one Sunday to meet up with the guys there to have my first chance of playing an oud..!


I bet, this will help you a lot and besides it will be a lot of fun!

fernandraynaud - 3-27-2010 at 03:46 AM

Diane,

The oud TYPE is a simple issue, though of course there are hybrids, and "modernizations". Few luthiers are 100% of one mindset on every oud they make. Hopefully I'm not insulting you by explaining basics you might know, but basically there ARE two types:

Arabian ouds are big, often decorated but a bit crude, with a long scale (> 600 mm) and are usually tuned C FF AA dd gg cc (big letters indicate the wound strings and notice the single retunable bass string).

Turkish ouds are smaller, with sharper timbre, spartan but more finely finished, with shorter scale (< 580 mm) and tuned one whole step higher, so the same strings usually can work.


Egyptian ouds are hard core Arabians, often played old-fashioned with only 5 courses, the bottom course unstrung, but usually made with enough pegs and holes for 6 courses. Palestinians I dunno what is in vogue, but old Syrians and Egyptians are fundamental. Iraqi ouds include the not-glued "floating" bridge (using a tailpiece and offering a brighter timbre) and the 7 course oud (either adding ff on top or a second tunable bass drone course). You likely don't want either of those. Syrians include Sukars, Halabbis and many makers' instruments. Syrian ouds are often based on traditional Arabian patterns, like historical Nahats.

The professional Grand Concert ouds might use elements from this or that region, but they are often custom made, or a particular luthier's dream ouds.

Ibrahim Sukar is an engineer in Aleppo and his ouds offer great value and smart design, e.g. even output, predictable timbre. He also uses an adjustable neck, that only 3 makers have ever offered. Seems like a small thing ....

Ali Tutan says something worth pondering:

"Those who would like to buy an ‘ud’ should be aware that the distance of the strings from the soundboard should not be more than 3 mm’s at the point where the neck is connected to the body (the ‘tiz nevâ’ point). It is both difficult and expensive to fix the types of ouds where this distance is about 4-5 mm." You would be amazed at how many ouds fall into that group, either now or later.


The plane of the oud's fingerboard should angle slightly away from the soundboard so that at the nut it's about 4 mm BACK from the soundboard.

Much of the playability and timbral character of the Arabian oud is determined by the action. Personally I can't fathom buying the most stylistically appropriate and exquisitely made "Grand Concert oud " and ponder how major a neck job it might need in a few years (or next week, if you're buying remotely).

The secret is that to someone who's buying a $3500 oud, a $550 neck job might not be a problem. Or if you're a walking guru of the oud circuit, you won't pay European labor rates on such a repair anyway. By focusing on "Palestinian masters" it looks you've got people thinking for you in terms of masters' "grand concert" ouds, not Stradivarius quite, but sort of Guarnerius territory. . Either that or making a joke of it. You'd better clarify what your budget is. I don't know if you're in a position to pay these "professional Palestinian rates".

If on the other hand you're looking for a Volvo class instrument, Sukars, with their consistency and that adjustable neck, are wonderful, in a reasonable range of models and prices, say $400 - 950, and they are probably the only oud that you can safely purchase sight unseen.



Ararat66 - 3-27-2010 at 07:18 AM

Hi Diane

I sent you a U2U. btw who's your favourite oud player and how have you come to know the oud - are you from the East?

I used to live in Wales, Cardiff for 3 years then West Wales for a year, wet winters beautiful summers;)

Leon

Kelly - 3-27-2010 at 08:49 AM



Hi Diane
You are welcome to come upto Manchester anytime for a Sunday meeting.just contact via U2U for email and travel details etc. There are usually a good selection of arabic ouds mostly of Michael Moussa variety as well as a few others.

BTW Hobgoblin music used to have a few either second hand or new (Turkish) ouds of reasonable quality try their website or contact the shops direct.

diane - 3-27-2010 at 10:33 AM

Leon, My fav oud player has to be the young Hosam Eliwat. My 5 year old son is also a big fan :-) Though there are of course many amazing players. We have been lucky enough to have the Joubran brothers here in Aberystwyth. The oud? I'm not sure when I first became aware of it. I grew up second gen. Welsh in a quite private market town in England, with a lot of 'hiraeth' in the family, so a lot of my friends have come from other communities (people away from home thang) - esp as live in cities as an adult. Music was a big thing in our household and I've loved music with quarter tones (as well as welsh folk with its modal uniqueness) and a lot of Eastern European music since I was tiny - I remember my mum remarking on it.
My father was from Cardiff originally, though a long time ago - he was 68 when I was born! And it's too big a city for me (esp now its grown so much) and very 'British' feeling as an outsider, rather than 'European'. I'm not much of a city lass, though I do make exceptions!
What took you to Cardiff and West Wales? And where in West Wales, may I ask? I imagine study from the time lengths and maybe Aberystwyth?!
And Portsmouth? I took my degree there - some time ago now! Left for my Masters in Colchester.
Nice to make your aquaintance :-)
And Kelly, thank you. I've sent you a U2U ...hopefully! :-) See you very soon I hope :-)
Warmest wishes,
Diane
PS Budget, no I cannot afford a Palestinian masterpiece, much as that would be lovely! And I would not be deserving of it either as I cannot yet play! We will see what will be in time.

diane - 3-27-2010 at 10:37 AM

Oh and FernandRaynaud. Yes it is an Arabic oud that I'm wanting. I love the bass notes too much. :-) We have, as with many cultures, instruments with drones, also in our music on the fiddle, because our original crwths had this naturally. Maybe it reminds me of this. Maybe it is entirey separate just beautiful. I have loved much music I have heard on Turkish ouds but for me I especially like this deeper bass recalling.
I have to dash, sorry.
Warm regards, Diane

Aymara - 3-27-2010 at 10:45 AM

Quote: Originally posted by diane  
... as I cannot yet play!


But you can play piano and violin, so I expect, that you'll learn oud fast.

diane - 3-27-2010 at 12:50 PM

With this build up I begin to feel I can only disappoint! ;-)
Seriously, thank you for all your encouragement.
Just been talking about Welsh folk modes and history with a Romanian friend and it reminded me to note that we have a great debt to the gypsies in Wales that our music and indeed the Welsh harp survived through times of religious repression. They also introduce us to the fiddle. I suspect there has been an influence in our music also...which already loves minor scales! We, in my family, also have an small ancestral link to the South East Mediterranean, but I suspect the former influence is the link to other musical avenues and a long with an interest in other traditions, as I'm not convinced that musical taste can travel down generations without exposure! :-)
..Random thoughts :-) Warm wishes.

diane - 3-27-2010 at 12:58 PM


btw Not mean to be a link between music of gypsies and the oud, tangental thoughts stemming from where am I from and my tastes in music. I'm not always very linear, but hey! :-)

Aymara - 3-27-2010 at 01:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by diane  

... a link between music of gypsies and the oud ...


... is not that strange as it seems. Do a little research about "Al Andalus" and the origins of Flamenco :cool:
Quote:
I'm not always very linear, but hey! :-)


Which I consider an advantage ;)

diane - 3-27-2010 at 01:51 PM

Leon, I'll try to post some links, its not my favourite piece by him, but still exceptionally beautiful I think.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DcxvegE1T4
Don't know best way of posting links, but hopefully!! Can't find a link to his recent 'Taqasim' on you tube, only on facebook/myspace. Playing here now (not that that helps anyone else!..my tech know-how could be better :-)
See you.

diane - 3-27-2010 at 01:56 PM


Yaye! :-) I stand corrected, there's loads on You Tube!
And...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=g09tQOfN6ao
I'm getting there! :-)
Night night.

fernandraynaud - 3-27-2010 at 02:19 PM

Diane,

That Hosam Eliwat piece is beautiful, but it uses a lot of electronic enhancements, specifically major EQ, delay, reverb and a touch of chorus. Plus even the "solo" beginning part is not one oud, it's multiple tracks. I'm not even sure the bass notes are played on oud, it's a very layered sound. I'm all for it, unlike some of the traditionalists, but the point is that any decent oud can be made to sound like that with studio gear/software, and conversely nobody can play that like that on a single oud, no matter what.

diane - 3-27-2010 at 02:47 PM

Ah ha. Then that would be the difference between previous clips we'd seen of him, which to be fair were very impressive at the time, but which were him playing live on a sofa in a bar to the Joubran brothers. I understand :-)
Still our fav oud player of the moment from the previous clips though :-)
But the bass notes not played on an oud!!! :-( Oh, that IS a shame! :-) Not that I ever had any hopes of playing to such a high standard. But I do love those bass notes :-)
Anyhow, I'm off...again! :-) Good night all.

alfaraby - 3-27-2010 at 02:48 PM

Quote: Originally posted by fernandraynaud  
That Hosam Eliwat piece is beautiful


Excuse me, but this oud is in a very severe condition, it's not tuned properly and the player ... Oh Dear, God forgive me for I've sinned ...is even worse !!

This type of oud is sold everywhere in Egypt for a dime or two
Excuse me, excuse me, excu.. exc.. ex.. e.. ...

Alfaraby

diane - 3-27-2010 at 02:56 PM


Well, I'm sorry I disagree, Alfaraby. I consider the player to be a fine young artist and have watch clips of him unplugged also and was taken aback by his talent. You may be a great artist by comparison it is not for me to say I wouldn't know...but one isn't truely great by looking down on others so. A great person has no need to.
A little respect in your heart would go far.
I'm sorry to speak so harshly...particularly on such a pleasant site.

Aymara - 3-27-2010 at 03:06 PM

Hi again Diane,

Tony (Fernand) is right ... a lot of studio tricks ;)

BTW ... HERE's a Taksim of one of my favorite oud players: Mehdi Haddab. He became famous by his works with Speed Caravan and DuOud ... just search Youtube. That's the modern world of oud music ;)
Quote: Originally posted by diane  

But the bass notes not played on an oud!!!


The deepest notes are from a bass. But hey ... you know how deep an oud can go from the unplugged videos ... no need to worry.

Luttgutt - 3-27-2010 at 03:47 PM

Here is one of MY favorits :)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tOXwIYgl2MQ

P.s. Fernand, I am pretty sure the bass is oud. At least this sound is easely prodused by oud...

diane - 3-27-2010 at 03:48 PM

Hm. Thank you Chris. Yes, that's right up my street too. Much appreciated. I will search the further links later. :-)

In Hosam's defence the clips outside of the studio are still amazing. btw he suggested possibly getting a Turkish beginner's oud..though i know not why yet, but have asked just now.

It's late I should sleep, but thank you for the link. It's always a good thing to find new avenues one wants to be exploring :-) Sleep well.

fernandraynaud - 3-27-2010 at 04:10 PM

You can e.g. extend the bass on the oud an octave, you can even do it live with a little stomp box. Of course I love Mehdi Haddib.

It's impossible to be sure how a given sound was obtained. It's hard to say how expensive the oud was, it's not so important is it? That sound may or may not be pleasing to everyone, certain choices were made, I rather think the overall effect is just fine. Traditionalists prefer a specific slice of the available sonic options, that's good too. We need both, I think.

You can do so much with our current tools, it's nothing to be unhappy about. It's a reason to rejoice ! It is a great renewal and we can hope a great golden age of music that is slowly developing. People have access to music of all regions and all time periods at the touch of the mouse. That is very powerful. We are learning so much. The oud is being discovered by more people all over the planet than ever before, and that is wonderful. Yes the oud is a very special instrument, maybe a "sacred instrument" we can all agree on that, not just a "very nice" instrument. So it happens that people discover some very deep things along with superficial things.

As to the sounds on that recording, it doesn't matter how it's done, it's done using everyday studio methods and tools, and if you want, it can be done by YOU.

fernandraynaud - 3-27-2010 at 04:18 PM

Diane, you might find a Turkish oud more comfortable, a full Arabic oud is quite big, maybe very big ;-) So many people tune Turkish ouds to Arabic mode. Luttgutt I think has sold all his Arabic ouds because they are just too big for him after orthopedic problems.

But one caveat. One case I know of first hand was a player who only played/liked Arabian style, so he tuned his very nice Turkish oud down to Arabian, and rubbed it on camels and sang "Cheri je t'aime ... ya mustapha" to it. But I can testify that the timbre still retained unmistakably something of the Turkish instrument in this instance, nothing bad, but it didn't sound quite 100% Arabian, and he couldn't wait to sell it. I don't know if that's always true ???? Everybody should have ONE smaller/Turkish style oud, so why not make it your first one? What do you think, Luttgutt?

Diane, maybe take a break? Abandon the milk bottles and the kids, dress like Stevie Nicks, take the train to Instambul, go to Deniz Music, charm Ali Nasadir the owner and just pick out an oud that feels perfect to you.


Luttgutt - 3-27-2010 at 05:05 PM

Well, not long before I was born, oud was the females instrument (my mam, ante, grandma, her ante... all played oud). The arabic counterpart of trubadure was "Awalem" (in the FEMAL grammatic form). It WAS females that played oud!

My daughter is 12, and is playing a sukar 58,5cm!!

I don't know if there is any difference between turkish and arabic other then the size. If they differ on the bracing or not!

But yes, I have sold ALMOST all my "performence" arabic ouds (except for my "baby" model1:) And of course I still have the Nahats, my Ahmad Naji Almasri oud (my late teacher) And two more from the 18 sentury that I don't know who the maker is).

And I now have 5 ouds with 58,5cm, all made by Sukar (does that make them "turkish" ouds?).

ONE of those 58,5cm ouds (custom made of course) has an arabic timber and deep base that SURPASIS most proffetional arabic size ouds I have tried or heard.

And the oud I just finishe working on, has a very deep base even though I cannot say it sound "arabic". But maybe more like Trio Joubra sound.

So I don't think size alone is the issue :shrug:

Most existing Nahat ouds have what was called "female cut oud".

So by all means, I say go for the turkish size!

Aymara - 3-28-2010 at 01:28 PM

Quote: Originally posted by fernandraynaud  
..., maybe a "sacred instrument" ...


Some people say, it touches the soul ... maybe that's it.
Quote:
..., it's done using everyday studio methods and tools, and if you want, it can be done by YOU.


Yes, that's the point ... you just need a decent microphone or pickup and a (cheap) good software like Reaper and you're ready to go. Ok, a bit of learning is needed too ;)
Quote: Originally posted by Luttgutt  

So I don't think size alone is the issue :shrug:


No, there are many factors, that infuence the sound.

My oud for example also only has a string length of 58,5 cm, but because of the rosewood boul it has a very deep warm bass. I don't think a downtuned Turkish oud can sound like this.

But sound characteristics and oud designs is a very complex topic, about which we could discuss over several pages ;)

diane - 3-28-2010 at 10:32 PM

Thank you Luttgart. My computer is SLOW to load this clips, but what I've been able to hear of it so far it is beautiful. I managed to get a section of it further with violin also. I hadn't heard this combination before. Thank you very much. :-)
As for the Turkish or Arabic ouds...I guess I will have to try them and see. Hosam said the suggestion was just because of my location and prices to obtain a reasonable instrument. He apologised that his knwoledge is only in the Middle East, knows of good Syrian makers for very good prices, but that I would need to travel to Syria. Gave me some links of others who may know more.
Hm. I will need to try these instruments I think!! :-)
As for milk bottles...well we're vegan, and my little ones who are bigger now never knew bottles of anything thankfully. ;-) But yes, I am being plagued here I should be taking a break, round end July beginning of August. My little ones need one to one care 24/7, so...that's probably an immensely wise decision...did I say decision, I meant advice! :-) Thought maybe I'd learn some Arabic, which I only have a few phrases of but have always loved, and had always meant to visit Palestine, but other things always came up. And then there was the oud. Swayed me from the idea of going ot the Gaeltacht and studying Irish (which as a Welsh speaker recently being unhappy meeting Irish speakers and making them speak English to me in their own country - so for practical reasons really.. As my closest 'foreign' country heading west as which I can see on a clear day...) But then, my love of the Arabic language was greater and longer established and I came across this site...etc.
Hm. We'll see. Sorry you probably didn't need to know all the above! :-)
Never mind.
Thankfully this site has reopened for a spell and I now have copied down Kelly's details, so Manchester is back on :-)
Warm wishes to all, Diane

DaveH - 3-28-2010 at 11:25 PM

Hi Diane

Welcome to the UK oud scene! I sent you a U2U.

I haven't read all the thread above so I hope this is still relevant, but I would definitely add my voice to anyone recommending you get a sukar. It's the best tone to price ratio by far and I really don't think it's a good idea for someone who's starting out but is a decent musician to go for anything cheaper. I don't think you need to worry too much at the beginning about the difference in regional styles other than to steer clear of iraqi and turkish as these are quite specific and your preference is clearly for the syria/lebanon/palestine and (possibly) egyptian styles.

Good luck and I'll look forward to hearing what you end up with at a future get together in the UK.

fernandraynaud - 3-29-2010 at 12:06 AM

If you have time (to learn) and money, you have more options. But the safest by far is a Sukar, and they sound great and "Arabiac".

Palmyrami on e-bay gets Sukars in batches direct from Syria. Because the Model 1 is the base model they offer it at $499 and will actually part with it for under $400, down to $300. In the past this has included a fibergalss hard case. This is such a good deal it would be worth shipping to Europe. They have apparently sold the last batch, and we don't know when they will have more. Nor do we know what they will be selling at when they get more. Keep an eye on EBay.com (US). The Sukars that Arabinstruments.com sells are the more expensive models. Their Gawharet El Fans are known to be not as good as Sukars, but nobody here has dared buy one.

"See you after" Easter?

diane - 3-29-2010 at 12:08 AM

Thank you Dave :-)

diane - 3-29-2010 at 12:32 AM

Thank you Tony. Seems Sukars are coming in with a lot of backing here. I have learnt a great deal since my arrival on the site.
btw the ref to speaking English to Irish speakers in Ireland was only in that spaces for Irish speakers to speak Irish under pressure more so than in Wales even. Sorry my want not to be misunderstood makes me longwinded! :-)
And yes, the time I can devote to learning the oud will be sporadic due to life here, not as I would like to give to the instrument, but I hope still worthwhile. My violin forgives me for the nature of our relationship :-)

Warm wishes, Diane

Aymara - 3-29-2010 at 12:44 AM

Quote: Originally posted by diane  
..., the time I can devote to learning the oud will be sporadic due to life here, ...


Once you have your own oud, you'll want to play at least half an hour a day and I think even a mother should be able to arrange that?

And because you already are a musician, you'll be astonished, that even only half an hour a day will enable you to a good progress in learning.

Danielo - 3-29-2010 at 01:10 AM

Hello Diane,

From what I read of your posts your are not just willing to give the oud a try, you seem to start a long love relationship with the oud (this is usually what happens with this magical instrument - one day you hear it and you KNOW you will play it forever :) ).

I don't think then you should consider that as a beginner you should start with a 'cheap' instrument - especially because you have already a musical background. I think that even with a very modest training you can appreciate having a very good instrument. First the playability is better on a high-end oud (fingerboard of hard ebony, easily tunable pegs, low action,...) and second as soon as you master the basic plucking technique (with a good teacher it should not take a very long time) you will enjoy the beautiful timbre of the instrument. After all you don't need to be able to play in 16th notes over all the fingerboard to enjoy the sound :)

Of course there's the question of what you can afford.. If you can invest around 2000$, Nazih Ghadban, a very reputable luthier from Lebanon, has two women's size ouds
for sale now, see here. He's a very kind and helpfull person and he can arrange a safe shipping to your door (see ouds 1178 and 1135).


As for cheaper options, there's currently a Sukar for sale in Paris, see here, for around 220 pounds (probably negotiable as it's for sale for several months). However a standard size Sukar may be too big for you?

Still in France, there's a Fadi Matta for sale for 800 euros, He's also a renowned luthier from lebanon and this particular oud has a rather short string length (58.5mm), which may be good for you. However the bowl is a little big..


Dan




Aymara - 3-29-2010 at 01:34 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Danielo  
However the bowl is a little big...


... which is a big advantage if someone loves that deeeep bass notes like Diane and myself too ;)

diane - 4-11-2010 at 01:19 AM

Thank you Dan, and Chris and all.. I think my first step is to meet up with some oud players and their ouds and take it from there. May take a little while as a little hectic here at the mo. Thank you all for your advice and tips and insights.
Kindest regards, Diane

fernandraynaud - 4-11-2010 at 07:10 PM

Diane, i called the shop in Paris with the dusty Sukar, and they are closed until Tuesday. If I wuz you, I would offer 200 euros with shipping included and if it flies it would be A SIGN! plus you'd have yourself a heck of a deal, a Sukar does not disappoint, and start playing when the kids are asleep instead of thinking about when you might take the train or not.

"Life is short - get an oud"

diane - 4-12-2010 at 10:33 AM

Oo.. ...You were in Paris? Okay,... Hm. Yes, we co-sleep as they need night time care, but I reckon they could cope with even a beginner's oud playing!!! As long as they actually sleep and don't just want to play themselves!! Maybe just outside the door might be wiser!! :-) Hm....I should find the details.... .....(brain slowly whirring..)
Thank you Tony. When were you in Paris? Just recently? Did you see this oud, if so?
...Hm....
True, life IS short. :-)
Warmest thanks, Di

:-)

diane - 4-12-2010 at 10:46 AM

Tony sending you a U2U

bibo10 - 4-13-2010 at 11:49 AM

hey,

I highly recommend not starting with a cheap oud, it could be very discouraging and frustrating.
I wouldn't think too much about it, go straight to Michael Moussa, he is the nicest person u ll ever meet. email him at
♫
mgmmoussa@yahoo.com or call him on the phone, he has a couple of ouds available and I am sure he can help you, the price range varies since the ouds are different. I have sound files and few pictures. I am waiting for him to send me more and I will upload them.
You will fall in love when you hear the sound.

diane - 4-14-2010 at 09:07 PM

Thank you to all, esp. Fernand. Update coming shortly. And Bibo 10, you're right, Michael Moussa is an exceptional man. Thank you for that advice. :-)

bibo10 - 4-15-2010 at 08:26 AM

You are very welcome, make sure you take advantage of him and good luck with your search. As i said I will start a thread soon containing some renovated ouds by Michael Moussa, so stay tuned.
Another advice if I may, don't rush it!
see what is available and hear what people have to say, you will be surprised...

Mehran - 4-19-2010 at 02:08 AM

This may be of interest. A Sukar oud in the UK for auction.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Sukar-oud-lute-ud-3ood-no-reserve_W0QQitemZ11...

fernandraynaud - 4-19-2010 at 04:23 AM

I hasten to add that I see this is not "a 5 course oud", it's a standard 6 course, looks like the bottom string is just not installed.

BEGINNER OUD FOR $150

musiccorner - 7-1-2010 at 05:30 AM

PLEASE SEND YOUR EMAIL TO MUSICCORNER2009@YAHOO.COM